CHESTNUTXE 7,631 Posted September 11, 2018 T. Meyer I think it is. They'd be a 400 crank with the mains spun down to 2.75" down from 3". Probably some sort of Chev rod and/or custom pistons. Either that or full custom rods.In the past, 400 engines were worth scrap over there, so cores were cheap. They were made for 12 years vs only 4 for the clevo, so plenty more around. Dunno about now, folks are waking up to their bang-for-buck potential.Sent from my CPH1607 using TapatalkI mean a stroker kit to suit the 400 around 470 c.i oddSent from my SM-G570Y using Tapatalk 1 Britto reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gerg 10,872 Posted September 11, 2018 Never heard of that one, but sounds like a real chugger with about 4.7" stroke. That's diesel truck territory. Serious piston speed there Sent from my CPH1607 using Tapatalk 1 Valvebouncer reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FORD_MAN 1,026 Posted September 14, 2018 On 8/8/2018 at 10:18 PM, bear351c said: You can buy lifter bore sleeve kits, now. Ream out, press in sleeve, ream again, problem solved. Simples. Also saw on Roadkill Garage with the Clevo Commando build, (408C 650hp solid roller) about new lifters (solid roller tho) so you don't have to bush lifter bores, I'll look up who made them later. I'd love to build a 440 Clevo, Arrow block 4.125" bore, Scat 4.100" crank, Scott Cook SCM alloy heads, SCM air supremacy intake, BIG high lift solid roller cam, But for now I'll plan a 351 hyd roller or 393/408 AFD. after I rebuild my mates mystery 351c 2 CHESTNUTXE and bear351c reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CHESTNUTXE 7,631 Posted September 14, 2018 yeah im back on the hunt for a windsor or clevo to go sic big stroker i would really like the 468 windsor with dart block or big ass clevo or even consider 429/460 just finding engines at reasonable prices is getting hard even harder std bore blocks Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bear351c 10,338 Posted January 24, 2019 🤔 Hmmmm........... only an hour away, (checks bank balance) 4 CHESTNUTXE, Fingers, Carshamus and 1 other reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CHESTNUTXE 7,631 Posted January 24, 2019 max sixty thou bore ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gerg 10,872 Posted January 24, 2019 Hmm not too sure about this one. Tempting, clevo power is good and all but these are cast in China, not sure where they're machined. They had some problems early on with air pockets and inclusions in the castings, probably fixed by now (this was a couple of years ago).Also no 4.125 bore option, not a deal breaker but it's easy cubes and bigger bores unshroud the valves better.If you can land a US-made Dart Windsor for similar money, I think I know what my choice would be for now. Sent from my CPH1607 using Tapatalk 1 CHESTNUTXE reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CHESTNUTXE 7,631 Posted January 25, 2019 im quivering at the price Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CHESTNUTXE 7,631 Posted January 25, 2019 while on this alloy block topic,what is the best clevo block ? ,Fontana,arrow,dart ? rumor has it moffat had one from ford for his mustang as a trial cause the normal cast iron one was so heavy ,when he went to turn into the first corner the car went straight ahead compard to the boss 302. 1 gerg reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bear351c 10,338 Posted January 25, 2019 Hearing good things about the TMeyer Track Boss, but, don't know anyone who has the coin....... including me. 1 CHESTNUTXE reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CHESTNUTXE 7,631 Posted January 25, 2019 yes i have seen that one a while back Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FORD_MAN 1,026 Posted January 25, 2019 Cam Research were the ones who made the solid roller lifters from my earlier post, don't need oil restrictor or lifter bore sleeving max 4.060" sounds funny, Pavtek's website says 4.185" max, 0.250" wall at 4.155", They did have some issues with 1st batch, I'm sure I read on ford forums all blocks now come with sonic & hardness test reports aswell. They are iron block not alloy. Still heaps cheaper then T Meyer USA,Track Boss cleveland Iron at $4590(AU) which only 2 have been cast, CGI iron $6885(AU) or Alloy at $11,475(AU) Dart alloy block is $9895, SHP iron $3200, Iron Eagle $5000 (all prices from Precision Intl) Ben Gatt runs a supercharged 408 Fontana in his XA hardtop, & Mark Hunt, Huntsman Customline "wild bunch" car sometimes has a supercharged Clevo, I remember hearing him saying when he raced at Swan Hill Dragway it had a Cleveland in it. 1 gerg reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Boingk 884 Posted January 25, 2019 At those prices I'd be getting an older block hot tanked and machined. Hell, I put 302C heads on my 351C in an F350 and with a mild cam and 4bbl it went like hell! A big part of the reason they got killed was the looming 1976 emissions standard for US and in particular California which is notoriously strict. Part of the design of a Clevo is that it has inefficient low velocity ports and in open-chamber style produces poor power with mediocre emissions... albeit better than the closed chamber heads. Add to this its oddly low 1st piston ring, causing a thin ring of hard-to-ignite vapour mix, and you've got an emissions disaster by any standard. Also, the contemporaneously popular style of emissions regulations were not easily integrated into the Cleveland castings. These tended to be things like exhaust gas recirculation (EGR) and air-injection into the exhaust ports to encourage thorough burning of any remaining unignited mixture being expelled. With a short production run slated mainly for performance options and larger luxury cars, the Cleveland was replaced by the Windsor in most applications and quietly killed off. Another aspect to this was management. Apparently the head of development at the time the Cleveland went into production was somewhat of a mover 'n' shaker, and was an influencing factor in getting the project not only off the ground, but into production cars. As with many things, this quickly changed with new management, plus the aforementioned emissions standards and the Arab Emirates fuel crisis in 1972 inspiring a move away from larger capacity engines. Shame, they were pretty much the LS motor of their day, they just couldn't be efficiently adapted to meet regulations. - boingk 4 gerg, Thom, Carshamus and 1 other reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CHESTNUTXE 7,631 Posted January 25, 2019 well said boingk 1 Boingk reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gerg 10,872 Posted January 26, 2019 All great points, I'll add to/elaborate on the many reasons why the US Clevo died in 74:They were a heavier engine. The 351W was slightly lighter despite having a taller deck.The word "performance" for all manufacturers was becoming a forbidden word. A major key to the racy 351C, the 4V head (what made it a performance engine) was becoming redundant because performance was way down the list of priorities, and was of no advantage with all the smog requirements of the time.The federal laws in advertising engine horsepower had to be shown in DIN or net (ie: as installed in the vehicle) as opposed to the bullshit SAE figures they used to get with no water pump, alternator or exhaust system. Finally, people could see the inefficiency of the big lumps they were driving, some down by 100 HP with no changes to the tune. For the fuel they used, they provided poor performance.Efficiency is another good point, one well made by Boingk, was the open-chamber design that was better for emissions but worse for efficiency. The new laws pushing from one end and the fuel crisis from the other put the squeeze on manufacturers to cull the worst performing designs and focus on engineering the ones left into a feasible product. They were somewhat able to recoup the development cost of the Cleveland by continuing to build the 351M/400, an evolution of the Clevo but used in large cars and trucks. This range continued until 1982. It was a low-power, high-torque smog motor, a replacement for the 390.The cars coming out at the time were too small to take the large, heavy lump that the clevo was. The Mustang and the Pinto were going to be their bread-and butter models, which were 4 and 6-cylinder powered. Although, they did manage to wedge a smogged 302W into the last model of the Mustang II before the Fox came out. What eventually killed the 351M/400 was the difficulty in adapting to the new emissions standards of the 1980s, which required feedback via oxygen sensors which are (for obvious reasons) incompatible with air pump injection systems. Coupled with the reduced demand for an engine of that size in the lean-and-mean 80s, the cost of re-engineering the "M" motor was not justifiable.The reasons why the Cleveland continued in Aus right until the end of 82 was the fact that large family cars were still popular at the time. The Cleveland was already engineered for fitment into the Falcon/Fairlane chassis so there was no problem continuing that line, even if on a small scale. The tooling had already been made, so the rest was just production cost.Of course Ford pulled the pin in 82 and paid for it until the bitter end, but that's a whole new essay for another day. Sent from my CPH1607 using Tapatalk 3 Valvebouncer, CHESTNUTXE and Boingk reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bear351c 10,338 Posted January 26, 2019 But......... the noise 2 Valvebouncer and CHESTNUTXE reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CHESTNUTXE 7,631 Posted January 26, 2019 yes the clevo plays a noise of its own,like 8 trumpets screaming Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gerg 10,872 Posted January 26, 2019 I just free-revved mine to 6 yesterday.... The induction roar sounds bloody great. Hope it goes as well as it sounds Sent from my CPH1607 using Tapatalk 2 XPT and CHESTNUTXE reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FORD_MAN 1,026 Posted January 27, 2019 i Think XB's where last to be rated SAE on XB changed to DIN/NET on XC (plus some emissions things) XB 2 barrel 302C 240hp/179kw, XC 4 barrel 302C 202hp/151kw XB 2 barrel 351C 260hp/194kw, XC 4 Barrel 351C 217hp/162kw 2 gerg and CHESTNUTXE reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Boingk 884 Posted January 30, 2019 Yep, they sound good alright. This was my Effy: 2 1 gerg, bear351c and CHESTNUTXE reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CHESTNUTXE 7,631 Posted February 3, 2019 i will throw this pic in the thread 1 gerg reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gerg 10,872 Posted September 17, 2019 Looking at retro conversion (reduced base circle) roller cams. Can someone elaborate on if/why the factory 302W roller lifters are not compatible with the Cleveland block? The actual retro lifters are near triple the price but I can't see where the difference lies.Sent from my CPH1903 using Tapatalk 2 CHESTNUTXE and bear351c reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bear351c 10,338 Posted September 18, 2019 Nope, but interested to find out myself. Did a little research. seems the lifters raise up too high and uncover the oil hole in the side of the lifter, Bye, bye oil pressure..... http://351c.net/board/index.php?/topic/2414-sbf-roller-lifters-in-a-cleveland/ Looks like it can be done with the brass lifter bore inserts. Which also solves the old "oil issue" that Clevo's have. 1 gerg reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gerg 10,872 Posted September 18, 2019 Nope, but interested to find out myself. Did a little research. seems the lifters raise up too high and uncover the oil hole in the side of the lifter, Bye, bye oil pressure.....http://351c.net/board/index.php?/topic/2414-sbf-roller-lifters-in-a-cleveland/ Looks like it can be done with the brass lifter bore inserts. Which also solves the old "oil issue" that Clevo's have. Hey cheers bear, yeah i read that one too, but dont know if they were using the reduced base circle cam, also if there is a certain amount of lift where this occurs ie: if using a cam below a particular lift spec, this might not be a problem. I want a roller version of the same cam i have now. I'm done with flat tappets. Sent from my CPH1607 using Tapatalk 1 bear351c reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bear351c 10,338 Posted September 18, 2019 Fair comment, I was thinking that the actual casting around the lifter bores wasn't as high on the Weezer... Would a smaller base circle be any different? Roller cams have higher lift, don't they.? 1 gerg reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites