TF_250 398 Posted November 12, 2013 Got the head back today cut up, she's all good, plenty of material left so this port shape is good to go YAY Thats nice work mate just the picture i wanted to see at the moment give you a great idea, which port number in the head is that through?? nice work - shows the need to go easy around the short turn. good stuff. Amen to that i know about that all to well at the moment!! 1 Clevo120Y reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Clevo120Y 815 Posted November 12, 2013 Thanks guys, Yeah I was pretty confident that it would be OK but you can't be 100% sure until you do a test port and section it. The material left should make the head nice and reliable, in saying that some heads have more corrosion than others. Jason this is port number 4. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ando76 4,354 Posted November 12, 2013 Cam is going to cut the Bertha test head up so I will try and get some photos. We are using a bigger valve that yours so we are both a bit concerned about the short turn area - although cam said that it didn't sound hollow or thin on the die grinder so I think we will be right but like you say doesn't hurt to check. great stuff once again. 1 Clevo120Y reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mixalis 266 Posted November 13, 2013 Loving this thread stumper its great to see that your open with your results and i hope that honesty rewards your business venture mate! This is a great learning experience for some of us members that dont have access to this sort of thing you are doing, well done 2 Clevo120Y and Crazy2287 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Clevo120Y 815 Posted November 13, 2013 Thanks Tony, yeah if you can get some pics that would be awesome, that's the go with a test port, try some shapes and then cut it up, looking at mine I could probably improve the short turn radius a little, not much but there is enough material to improve it I think, the roof of the bowl could be raised a little as well but all in all the port worked out well. Mixalis, thanks for your compliments mate, I don't believe in bullshit and I'm happy to share, if something I do doesn't work or it goes pear shaped then I will share that as well, I always say there are things to learn from both the good and the bad. If I find the secret to making a crossy port flow over 260cfm and maintaining good port wall integrity I might keep that to myself for a while LOL. 2 Mixalis and Thom reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ando76 4,354 Posted November 13, 2013 Just noticed how thin it is around the valve guide boss area as well. Hmm hope the test head doesn't show any surprises. There is plenty of meat around the valve seat area but you really just want to taper that back into the original material and not go too far. Also plenty of meat around the port face. Just looking at the short turn and about 1cm up from the valve seat - I reckon that area could be tapered back a bit to lessen the radius of the short turn as it sort of dumps it at that point. Suggestion only. On an individual runner set up you could really have some fun on the port entry and with a bigger inlet valve I reckon it would go off. Bit of attention to the exhaust port and you would have a seriously fast car. I can't believe the detail and info I have gained by your head sectioning. Great work. I'm off to the shed with the diegrinder.... 1 Clevo120Y reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
matt_lamb_160 252 Posted November 14, 2013 Starting with a cut std. port would be interesting. I'd like to see the valve guide area on a std one. 1 Clevo120Y reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
plytme 2 Posted November 14, 2013 Been reading this thread daily now and to be honest, I genuinely don't understand all the info in here, way outta my league!!!, but thanks heaps for giving even me, a bit of an understanding, of what a ported head internally looks like, this is an awesome thread and I hope from this you obtain genuine paying customers from it, well deserved. Keep up the good work and again thanks. Cheers Scott 2 Clevo120Y and slydog reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Clevo120Y 815 Posted November 14, 2013 Tony your suggestion on the short turn is exactly what I was thinking Now I can see the material left there it can be layed back nicely I think. Glad I could help with the section mate if it's of value to you, Cheers. Matt I will send the head off again to get a stock port cut as well I think, I am also interested in the amount of material I have removed, you can kind of tell when your doing it but a comparison would be better. Plytme it is my pleasure to share the details with you lot and even better if you have a better understanding of it after reading it all, also thanks for your kind words about starting my adventures business wise. 1 Mixalis reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Clevo120Y 815 Posted December 21, 2013 Finally got the race head done, 212cfm at the 550thou of lift that the cam has, should be building the bottom end on Friday and setting up to race on the 4th of January, hopefully all goes well and the customer gets a good showing for once. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ando76 4,354 Posted December 21, 2013 head and manifold look the business. I like to get into the oil return area of the head with the die-grinder and de-bur it to allow oil drain back. Are you going to tap a fitting into the back right hand corner of the head for an additional oil return to sump? I do this on all my x-flow speedway heads and a great deal of oil accumulates in that back right hand corner due to the G forces. Nice work and with 212cfm she should be a monster. 1 Clevo120Y reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tyler06 266 Posted December 22, 2013 Gotta ask this, ive seen 238cfm at 6k claimed. Wat needs to be done to get this? Im not technically savvy wen it comes to the flowing side and thats why im asking.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tyler06 266 Posted December 22, 2013 Is there a guide for dummys on head flow and engines Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Clevo120Y 815 Posted December 22, 2013 Thanks Tony, no external oil drain at this time but the next one will. I am going to build an engine for myself so I have full control of how things are done and all of these extras will be done. Then I just have to find a car to and driver to use it and test it for me LOL. Chris 238cfm of head flow is possible and requires a great port shape to achieve, in this speedway catagorey I personally think that unless the rest of the flow figures increase in the lift range then with the manifold as big a restriction that it is the topend flow is wasted. David Vizard has a book called "how to port and flow test cylinder heads" and is a good read. 1 matt_lamb_160 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ando76 4,354 Posted December 22, 2013 Agreed 238cfm @ 600 is well and truly possible but you will pay for the port work, seat cut, necked down valve stems, and tapered valve guide bosses required to achieve that figure. You would want to be running a really good inlet manifold with even cylinder fill to achieve max hp, i.e. individual runner style. A wise man once said 'I've never seen a flow bench win a race' and that is important to remember. Like dyno's they are a tool to measure changes/improvements. As they only suck at a constant pressure they are different from an engine and sometimes engines that shouldn't make power (according to the bench) do because of good low lift figures and well matched cam etc. Over .600 lift requires a fair bit of mechanical effort and whether the power gains achieved from lifting past that are worth the extra effort and strain is something I'm yet to decide. I'm sure Sean will be concentrating on improving flow up to your peak cam lift and even if it tapers or holds up to that lift and maintains good low lift figures you will have a weapon on your hands. Vizards books and articles are a wealth of information - some would say his works are dated but I don't subscribe to that theory as it relates to our applications. I love his stuff on 'no loss' exhaust systems, very cool stuff and how every car is in fact its own dyno. Clever stuff. 2 Clevo120Y and gerg reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
slydog 7,873 Posted December 22, 2013 The only issue I have with re-working my head if and when is I wonder if my valve reliefs in my pistons are big enough to take a bigger inlet valve? I do however follow the thoughts of lift over duration...but when it come down to it it's prob all just a different way to achieve the same outcome??? Horses for course's...LOL 1 Clevo120Y reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ando76 4,354 Posted December 23, 2013 Just get yours running wild man so we can see what numbers it runs before you worry about modifying the bloody heads. lol you crack me up. 2 slydog and Clevo120Y reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
slydog 7,873 Posted December 23, 2013 Hook line and sinker...LOL 1 Clevo120Y reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ando76 4,354 Posted December 23, 2013 If only the barra hit that hard hey??? 3 slydog, Clevo120Y and XPT reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ando76 4,354 Posted December 23, 2013 Looks like wagoon just scored himself a Ivan WALKER crossflow head fully loaded for $200. I spotted the head on Gumtree in Brisbane and he grabbed it. It's off to the flow bench to see if the sellers claims are valid but I can tell you it looks the goods. Old mate seller didn't know what he had. Bargain x-flow performance there.... 1 Clevo120Y reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wagoon 2,429 Posted December 23, 2013 ^^ I'm not worthy, I'm not worthy^^ Props to Ando for the find and heads up, you are to kind. 1 Clevo120Y reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lord_fahrquhar 2,580 Posted December 23, 2013 Nice work. Lucky bugger! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ando76 4,354 Posted January 2, 2014 Head flow figures for the 'Bargain X-Flow' head. LIFT IN EX % 100 52.6 43.42 82.5 200 105.21 83.5 79 300 153.6 100.2 65 400 192 119.4 62 500 209.5 131.9 62 600 197 133.6 67 700 197 136.9 69 Not bad inlet figures on a standard valve but the exhaust flow drags the percentages down. I would say that this head was done for a 2 barrel speedway application looking at the figures. Never the less for $200 it is a bargain and with a minor tickle on the inlet and a good touch of the exhaust this head will run some good numbers with the four barrel inlet that it will be running. The cam profile will also help the percentages as well so I think old wagoon will be holding on. Long live the X-Flow.... 2 slydog and Clevo120Y reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Clevo120Y 815 Posted January 3, 2014 They are great results, thanks for putting them up. You won't get better value than that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Clevo120Y 815 Posted January 3, 2014 Picked this up today for myself, balanced bottom end, floating pistons, ported head, springs and rollers and a decent cam. 2 gerg and Trev Vaa reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
