Jump to content
Grimmy

Xd aircon

Recommended Posts

Hi all . 
has anyone had some luck in getting the ac in their xd any colder  than an evaporative cooler ?? 
I have an xf pump ,condenser and receiver dryer , low pressure hose routed to passenger side so it don’t burn on exhaust lol and an r134a tx fitted with the std xd evaporator. The system has 750g of gas as a start , the most info I could find said around that weight though mine will be a little different due to miss match components. I might have to resort to lpg if all else fails haha 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Anything running R12 and a York compressor originally, should be beyond freezing cold.

People have forgotten how good the x-series A/C systems were.

 

There are many variables - superheat/subcooling, being an important one.

If you're running R134a refrigerant, it will never absorb or reject atmospheric heat correctly, running with a non-parallel flow

evaporator and condensor. (less surface area)

 

R134a is less efficient than R12,

so R134a compressors have a higher capacity, to move more refrigerant.

 

Contrary to what 'experts' may say, you will need to run a natural/hydrocarbon refrigerant like Hychill. (ie, a refrigerant close to the LPG family)

Or R12, which is un-obtainium in this country.

Hychill is lighter than R12, so only requires 1/2 - 1/3 the charge when filling by weight, to achieve the same volume.

(ie, R12 was a heavy refrigerant)

 

R134a is in the middle weight-wise, but taxes the system over R12, since it will run higher pressures.

Hychill is not quite as good as R12 was, but the PT spec's are miles better than R134a.

 

Whenever I do an x-series Aircon refurb, I suggest to stay 100% factory,

remove and flush the evap/condensor cores with my flush machine,

same with all the lines.

 

The evaporator core, I pressurise and submerge in a test bath to check for leaks,

before re-using it. 

(Similar to tyre repair guys)

 

I also remove the compressor, drain and re-fill the compressor oil with synthetic or new mineral oil,

(PAG oil is for R134a, and also turns acidic with moisture absorption)

plus I'll test/replace the compressor bearings if rough/noisy.

 

I test the TX valve operation by removing and freezing/thawing it.

Inspect all the o-rings and replace if obviously damaged, worn or leaking.

 

The Hychill Minus 30 I use, has a fluorescent green dye in it.

 

The system gets vacuumed down, and left overnight to test for leaks.

After charging the system the following day, I test the A/C thermostat set-points,

and suggest a return visit after a week or so, to check for any tiny refrigerant leaks.

 

The above is very labour intensive and not cheap, but I've found it's the only reliable way.

90% of x-series A/C systems have sat empty for over a decade, so anything less,

and the owner risks wasting alot of their money, IMO.

 

Factory x-series systems are brilliant, when working correctly.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I purchased an xd fairmont years ago that had the York compressor and R12 gas in it. I’ve never had a/c as cold as that car since. It was that good in fact that I thought it was blowing smoke out of it on one particularly humid day. I took it to the local garage after a hasty panic to remove the battery lead. The mechanic laughed and said it was moisture droplets forming as the cold air met the hot humid air in the car. We were both very impressed with how well the R12 was working

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can you explain the superheat part ? 
I asked all the places in town and even the google machine and never got a straight answer . I ask because there is 2 tx valves available with different properties , I forget which one I got . 
when I got the car it had a complete sealed York system on it but the pump was shot , I replaced it with a used xf sanden style pump . It’s all original xseries stuff other than the r12 

I did notice that when I charged it , when it cycled on , the low side was only around 15-20 psi at around 2k rpm . Maybe just needs more gas ? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

in My opinion the XF compressor is the worst part of that system, they can work.. when new(all the old ones i had were stuffed)
 

the sanden one that looks similar is still available. 

 

one of the best few air cons i've had were in XD and XE (the 1992 Lexus LS400 was best, the new 1999 pulsar i have is pretty amazing, but we haven't had a HOT day yet)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Grimmy said:

Can you explain the superheat part ? 
I asked all the places in town and even the google machine and never got a straight answer . I ask because there is 2 tx valves available with different properties , I forget which one I got . 
when I got the car it had a complete sealed York system on it but the pump was shot , I replaced it with a used xf sanden style pump . It’s all original xseries stuff other than the r12 

I did notice that when I charged it , when it cycled on , the low side was only around 15-20 psi at around 2k rpm . Maybe just needs more gas ? 

 

Superheat = the low side gauge temp reading, compared to a measurement of the evaporator outlet pipe temperature.

(the difference being the superheat).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Can you explain the superheat part ? 
I asked all the places in town and even the google machine and never got a straight answer . I ask because there is 2 tx valves available with different properties , I forget which one I got . 
when I got the car it had a complete sealed York system on it but the pump was shot , I replaced it with a used xf sanden style pump . It’s all original xseries stuff other than the r12 
I did notice that when I charged it , when it cycled on , the low side was only around 15-20 psi at around 2k rpm . Maybe just needs more gas ? 
Hope this helps mate.
5058fb73f03aca046a328696306cf7ce.jpg2f12081ede3ea4b03e2e0ee96816723c.jpgbbe142925c8149aad9ea1c2ea333e33f.jpg19a5728fa822aee9cc39f218e9d31e2b.jpg4440a673fad3d977ad947fae4b4de0c9.jpg
From XF workshop manual.

Sent from my S21 using Tapatalk

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

good to see you guys learnt enough at school to understand  all that to get the air con working   way over my head and last time i had the au regassed costa lot   worked for a month took it back to my friend who is another like  "jacks mate"  so your not alone outback  lol   think the c.....t  left town years ago  but my cheap solution was engel 40  an windows down for cool down on long drives works a treat still works today but have to admit the h2o liquid is a lot clearer now lol   hope it all goes well for ya Grimmy

cheers demmo

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Grimmy said:

Which tx should I have ? 
 

Tx9015 or tx9041 ? 
 

The one I have has 329-412 , I think is the 9015 

 

329-412 is an Ashdown-Ingram number, equivalent to the 9041.

 

TX9041

2 tonnage

4.4degrees Superheat

 

TX9015

1.5 tonnage

2.8degrees Superheat

 

I'd stick with the TXV you have, and start there.

 

In a nutshell, the higher capacity TXV's (tonnage) requires a higher superheat, to ensure all the refrigerant gets boiled to a vapour within the evap core,

before reaching the compressor.

Since liquids don't compress, the compressor will not fair well, if it has to deal with liquid refrigerant.

 

12.000 Btu = 1 Ton

 

When air is cooled or heated, the heating or cooling of the air is called sensible heating, and heating or cooling of water vapor in the air is called latent heating.

The cooling process takes place at the evaporator.

As warm moist air moves across the coil the water vapor condenses and is removed from the air,

this is commonly seen as water dripping from an air conditioning system.

 

A large amount of energy is required to heat or cool the water in the air.

It is therefore important that we know both temperature and relative humidity of the air to calculate how much heating or cooling is taking place.

This is especially important to get a more accurate system efficiency calculation.

 

The amount of heat (sensible and latent) in air is referred to as enthalpy.

 

R12 and R134a refrigerants are pure refrigerants - ie, azeotropic.

Hychill, is a Zeotropic refrigerant (blend of R600a - isobutane and R290 - propane).

 

Zeotropic refrigerants have a wider evaporating/condensing temp range.

 

When evaporating, the most volatile component will boil off first and the least volatile component will boil off last.

The opposite happens when gas condenses into liquid.

for a given pressure, the temperature will change in the liquid-vapor mixture region.

 

This results in a gliding evaporation and condensing temperature along the heat transfer surface.

 

In practice, the saturation temperature at the inlet of the evaporator will be lower than at the outlet.

In the condenser, the saturation temperature at the inlet will be higher than at the outlet.

 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, dex said:

Well ,,,

Looks like I learnt something today ,,,

 

 

scratch that ,

still don’t want to see my report card at the end of the year .. 

 

 

i was going ok with the text .. saw the diagrams and went.. scratch that, I turn the switch on and cold air comes out.. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 hours ago, bear351c said:

Is that like Schroedingers cat.........?

i had to look that up... click if needed

 

but yeah, if the air con doesn't work... but you don't turn it on.. then who's to say it doesn't work, just not switched on?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, gerg said:

So it's basically "tree falls in woods" but geeked up by 1000%
 

 

Yes I guess so,

a broken b-series blend-door shaft, results in the HVAC system blowing both hot AND cold at the same time.

(often each temperature extreme, out differing vents)

 

Hence - schrodingers blend-door shafts.

 

E-series mid/high series do it too, but it's the blend-door motor which fails,

generating the dreaded E2 climate control error code.

 

Both are dash-out fixes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites



 

 
E-series mid/high series do it too, but it's the blend-door motor which fails,
generating the dreaded E2 climate control error code.
 
Both are dash-out fixes.


Oh great... That's likely what happened to my mum's EL wags then. No heat, but AC worked ok.

My sister's ex drives it now, he's got no clue about cars either

Sent from my CPH1920 using Tapatalk

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×