xeeclipse 37 Posted May 7, 2013 Just wondering what kind of economy you chaps are getting? My specs are as follows... 87 XF wagon (straight lpg) 250 xflow crow 14221 cam 9.5.1 comp EfI manifold 2.77 Diff gears 3 speed auto 225 mixer E type IMPCO converter 2x 90L APA tanks Weight: 1740kg (gross mass) I'm getting 25L per 100km around town and not sure on the highway but around 18L i think Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gav 616 Posted May 7, 2013 Around 17.5L/100k mixed city driving (freeways/local roads) stock engine, 5-speed, 3.23 diff complex convertor, venturi mixer over Webber carburettor...revs to 2500rpm before running outta steam with around 50kW at the wheels LOL! Apples and oranges comparison. Your auto and diff ratio wont be helping your economy much! Speaking of apples and oranges, my daily EB Falcon hack gets around 13.5L/100km for a similar driving mix...4L 5-sp manual 3.27 diff with thermofan conversion (no viscous clutch fan drag) L-type IMPCO with 225-mixer - so cheap to run which is why I keep it! Reckon I could get 550-600km from a 68-litre tank in the sticks (once drove Melbourne-Bairnsdale-Melbourne without a refill). The best my XF could do was Melbourne-Bairnsdale-Droiun on the return leg). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
deankxf 20,288 Posted May 7, 2013 15 litres per 100 km on all my stock motors past and present.. doesnt change much for city or highway or auto to T5 manual most were 2.77 or 2.92 diff one was 3.23 with T5 still the samemy mild crossflow on GRA with 99rwkw was a guzler, used to use about 20litres per 100km.. used to go pretty good though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
xeeclipse 37 Posted May 7, 2013 Yeah it is a slug around town but not any slower then the stock crossy that I had in there, which is suprising cause it is 200kg heavier then stock. The 14221 crow cam is a highway cam and from 100-150kmh in top gear she flies (for a crossy that is). It stops making power around 3,800rpm. Wendy at crow cams told me that no one had ever had any success running the 14221 cam on LPG due to poor vacuum (109 degree lobe separation). Took me ages to get right but quite happy with it now, thank god crossflows can tolerate some detonation and lean running lol Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mcfly94 169 Posted May 7, 2013 wow wtf! wes was getting something like 15l 100km on the highway with his xe turbo, how come you guys are getting similar figures, didnt have like an estimated 550rwhp? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
deankxf 20,288 Posted May 7, 2013 wow wtf! wes was getting something like 15l 100km on the highway with his xe turbo, how come you guys are getting similar figures, didnt have like an estimated 550rwhp? have you asked a driver of a modern car thats been converted? most V6 commos get about 15 also.. Wes's spent some quality time being tuned by the best in the business..... that would be one reason. the combo was also matched correctly would be another reason. i used to get 20litres per 100km out of a 351 clevo, thought that was crap till i had a 202 VH commo converted on a reco motor and got the same...... 1 bigpaulo reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mcfly94 169 Posted May 7, 2013 have you asked a driver of a modern car thats been converted? most V6 commos get about 15 also.. Wes's spent some quality time being tuned by the best in the business..... that would be one reason. the combo was also matched correctly would be another reason. i used to get 20litres per 100km out of a 351 clevo, thought that was crap till i had a 202 VH commo converted on a reco motor and got the same...... nope, mine was more of question, because i dont understand the figures. I understand that. I want to gas my crossflow later maybe for turbo, whats the costs like in comparison to petrol, work out the same in the end? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gerg 10,871 Posted May 7, 2013 TF Corty, 4-speed, 2.92 diff, 15" Saab wheels. Had a freshened XF 4.1, mild cam and 6-2-1 extractors. Had a Nolff's NCA-300 mixer and simple converter. Best economy was about 13.5l/100, worst maybe 16l/100. Went well, had bullshit torque but breathless above 4500. I think your mixer is too small. Your diaphragm might be maxing out, and your engine has nowhere else to suck from except the fuel supply. In other words, the restriction is causing pressure drop and sucking too much gas under acceleration. I'd actually get a bigger mixer and go from there. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
xeeclipse 37 Posted May 7, 2013 Economy is largely dictated by power to weight and gearing at the end of the day. My combo is borderline unfortunetly cam has 205/209 duration at .050" which is as far as you can go I think with a 2.77 and stock 3 speed auto. pistons are acl 28cc, the only modification was shaving the HF5 head by .080' (2.0mm) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
deankxf 20,288 Posted May 7, 2013 nope, mine was more of question, because i dont understand the figures. I understand that. I want to gas my crossflow later maybe for turbo, whats the costs like in comparison to petrol, work out the same in the end? would definitelty depend on the tune on petrol i think.. most 4 litre ish motors get around 15litres per 100km from gas from what i have seen.. on petrol is another story though, whereas EFs and things were often getting better than 9litres per 100km on petrol(i had an EBXR6 that used to average 10litres petrol per 100km all the time) so theres cost comparison per 100km.. eg 15 litres LPG at 70cents = $10.50 per 100km or 8 litres petrol at $1.30 also = $10.50 per 100km would depend on emissions rules for turbo? thought LPG was one way of getting over the line? depends on expected power from both with turbo you'd still be spending money on upgrading the petrol system anyway in most cases. 1 XTREME KARTS XF reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dizzy616 183 Posted May 7, 2013 hmm i might not know the figures. but sware i spent less driving around on gas instead of petrol. ive got alot further on $10 worth of gas instead of $10 on petrol Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gerg 10,871 Posted May 7, 2013 A petrol EF might get 9 litres/100 km maybe on the open road, but my manual EF got 11-12l/100km in suburban stop/start driving. So lets not compare apples with beetroots. 15l/100km around town on gas is what cabbies generally talk of, but due to the crudeness of most gas systems, open road economy isn't much better, as I've found. That is unless you have the more sophisticated feedback system. Even better than that, a modern liquid injection setup is the ultimate. More power than petrol and much better economy than with vapour mixers. In my experience, LPG economy around town is largely dictated by vehicle weight, whereas open road economy is mostly dependent on the efficiency of the gas system. My 4-speed brick-shaped Corty shat all over my EA 5-speed, (which was much more aerodynamic) on long trips because of the gas setup. The EA was dual-fuel and had an inline Impco mixer. Best I got was 390. Best in the Cortina was 450. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Yes.40L 52 Posted May 20, 2013 would definitelty depend on the tune on petrol i think.. most 4 litre ish motors get around 15litres per 100km from gas from what i have seen.. on petrol is another story though, whereas EFs and things were often getting better than 9litres per 100km on petrol(i had an EBXR6 that used to average 10litres petrol per 100km all the time) so theres cost comparison per 100km.. eg 15 litres LPG at 70cents = $10.50 per 100km or 8 litres petrol at $1.30 also = $10.50 per 100km would depend on emissions rules for turbo? thought LPG was one way of getting over the line? depends on expected power from both with turbo you'd still be spending money on upgrading the petrol system anyway in most cases. Your only paying $1.30 for petrol down there!!!! average price in canberra is about $1.50. and gas around $0.79 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
deankxf 20,288 Posted May 20, 2013 Your only paying $1.30 for petrol down there!!!! average price in canberra is about $1.50. and gas around $0.79 i dont know, i dont buy petrol.. i googled todays petrol prices and that was the price..... its $1.50 today according to the interwebs. gas is still around 60 cents.... how does the Aussie Dollar Vs USDollar affect fuel prices? that is going backwards fast Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
78xcgxl 241 Posted May 20, 2013 My XC gets around 400km+ on a tank of gas (70L) so roughly 17L per 100kms. Stock iron head crossflow with strongberg carby, 4speed, 2.92, extractors, 2 1/4 inch exhaust and stock 14inch rims with 205s. Driving both city and freeway but i do drive the car pretty hard now that i converted it to manual. Overall the car is cheap as to run, only just recently refilled the tank on completely empty (got in 73L) at 57.6 cents a litre with a coles 8 cent discount and it cost me $36.46! Looking forward to fitting a el ohc motor with a T5 in the near future ohc engines love the gas! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Neil Armstrong 92 Posted May 28, 2013 costs me around 80 bucks to fill my ute on fuel, and i get about 300km around town use or 550ish on feeway, stock engine i think it has a tow pack cam and 5spd, ill post some stats up of the turbo gas ghia when i get it sorted! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PRO250 1,506 Posted May 29, 2013 my xe does about 280 off boost of you push it a bit it goes to 4km a tank LOL 1 mcfly94 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dizzy616 183 Posted May 30, 2013 id say my ute does around 450+ a tank give or take country or town driving. its fairly economic. got a decent sized gas converter to. bigger than my one on the old ute. but it seems to be doing better. them both where stock. atleast i think my new ones stock.dont know how many k's it would do on petrol haven't tried to start it on petrol yet. aparently it stalled a bit so carby must need a clean up Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GspecZL 979 Posted May 30, 2013 My ZL is currently getting about 18l per 100 km on gas. The tune is shocking and the gas system is cheap. But it is also chewing through petrol at about 15 l per 100. Gas is only 55c near me but i hate how gutless it is. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dizzy616 183 Posted May 30, 2013 go to supagas to top up gas if you got one near by. they love that stuff still doesn't go as hard as petrol but gos a bit better than regular servo lpg. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
xeeclipse 37 Posted May 30, 2013 Update..... Still adjusting my tune, my economy is seriously bad. 30L around town and 25L on the highway I've bought another throttle body and relocated all my converter reference hose and bypass hoses for the mixer. My main gripe is a lack of vacuum signal to the converter, haven't checked how much vacuum its pulling but it can't be very high. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
xeeclipse 37 Posted June 12, 2013 Down to 18 on the highway and around 25L around town....god I Love LPG Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
xeeclipse 37 Posted June 18, 2013 Down to 18L around town and 15 on the highway .....Wish someone with LPG knowledge could have taught me earlier cause it has been an ordeal to say the least.... Secret? If using a low vacuum cam on an impco 225 or 200 mixer the only way to meter the idle mixture is by putting slots into the LPG valve supply tube. I initially collapsed the LPG valve spring which just made the gas piss out at an alarming rate. Funnily enough using 10 Litres more per 100km didn't rob the engine of power....got to love LPG Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
deankxf 20,288 Posted June 18, 2013 Down to 18L around town and 15 on the highway .....Wish someone with LPG knowledge could have taught me earlier cause it has been an ordeal to say the least.... Secret? If using a low vacuum cam on an impco 225 or 200 mixer the only way to meter the idle mixture is by putting slots into the LPG valve supply tube. I initially collapsed the LPG valve spring which just made the gas piss out at an alarming rate. Funnily enough using 10 Litres more per 100km didn't rob the engine of power....got to love LPG is that an FB(feed back) or CA (clean air) impco 225? what did you slot i think i read that FB type idle richer so they can be trimmed using the impco commander system(1991 onwards injected cars) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
xeeclipse 37 Posted June 19, 2013 I put a couple of slots into the tube that the LPG valve bottoms out on. It's a vacuum operated 225 mixer like used on every ecotec V6 commodore. No fancy commander units here Share this post Link to post Share on other sites