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XF 4.1 popping!

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it might still come good, they are a bit weird.. it probably popped the pushrod out due to sitting so long the lifters bled down.

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My blue xf had a stuck Open a smidge exhaust valve , so Previous owner removed both intake and exhaust pushrods to that cylinder..

 

only found out after 12 months driving !

it was only after it bent and popped out the pushrods on another cylinder and ran like absolute crap that I became aware of it . 
 

driving it with one cylinder down for so long I just thought it had just a 3.3 “ 200 motor in it that was a bit tired . 
 

bunged another head on with ALL 6 cylinders running and the Ute ran like a champ 

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12 hours ago, deankdx said:

it might still come good, they are a bit weird.. it probably popped the pushrod out due to sitting so long the lifters bled down.

 

That's a good point. Not sure how the intake rod didn't fall out. Still might!

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23 minutes ago, dex said:

My blue xf had a stuck Open a smidge exhaust valve , so Previous owner removed both intake and exhaust pushrods to that cylinder..

 

only found out after 12 months driving !

it was only after it bent and popped out the pushrods on another cylinder and ran like absolute crap that I became aware of it . 
 

driving it with one cylinder down for so long I just thought it had just a 3.3 “ 200 motor in it that was a bit tired . 
 

bunged another head on with ALL 6 cylinders running and the Ute ran like a champ 

 

Yeah my Ute is running really well now apart from the clacking. The transmission is still doing some funny things though. I might need to start another topic lol. 

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5 minutes ago, Hgpilot said:

 

That's a good point. Not sure how the intake rod didn't fall out. Still might!

dont rev it too high for a while

it will either come good.. or it won't.. 
crossflows can tick away for yonks.. 
call it a TICKford enhanced crossflow.. hear it ticking ... TICK ford.. lol.

 

there's ways it can be fixed, if your Dad was a mechanic he'd know the potential of why it's ticking.. (wiped cam, gunked up or worn lifter it the most likely, can be bodged by grinding the rocker shaft post so it takes up the slack(if you were doing this you'd get a spare one.. ...incase the motor was being fixed later, otherwise you add a shim to set the pre load)

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9 hours ago, deankdx said:

dont rev it too high for a while

it will either come good.. or it won't.. 
crossflows can tick away for yonks.. 
call it a TICKford enhanced crossflow.. hear it ticking ... TICK ford.. lol.

 

there's ways it can be fixed, if your Dad was a mechanic he'd know the potential of why it's ticking.. (wiped cam, gunked up or worn lifter it the most likely, can be bodged by grinding the rocker shaft post so it takes up the slack(if you were doing this you'd get a spare one.. ...incase the motor was being fixed later, otherwise you add a shim to set the pre load)

 

Haha Tick Ford, that's good. Unfortunately this Tick Ford doesn't have any more power. 

Yeah he reckons it's the all gunked up. The oil that was in it was horrible sludge. We ran eninge flush and new oil hoping to free the lifter. My oil pressure is much better now (I have a gauge) so who knows, it may come good. 

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If you can still be bothered, you can pull apart the lifter and clean out the plunger and disc valve. If the guts are a bit stuffed (worn), source another good one and swap the guts over so you have the same lifter face running on that lobe but with new guts.

Sent from my CPH1607 using Tapatalk

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If you can still be bothered, you can pull apart the lifter and clean out the plunger and disc valve. If the guts are a bit stuffed (worn), source another good one and swap the guts over so you have the same lifter face running on that lobe but with new guts.

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I've done that many more time than I would care to admit, but it's always been successful

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13 hours ago, Hgpilot said:

 The oil that was in it was horrible sludge. 

 

Hell yeah.!   Looks like it ran for 100,000 kays without changing the oil.!   Other way you get sludge like that is running the engine too cold. ( wrong thermostat/fans/oil viscosity)

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Yeah not sure I can be bothered now. You would have to take the head off I'm assuming? I might still do it yet but would probably just get a whole set of lifters. Yeah the oil has been in there at least 15 years and only ever ran cold basically. Not to mention the thermost housing and water pump were rusted out. 

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4 minutes ago, Hgpilot said:

Yeah not sure I can be bothered now. You would have to take the head off I'm assuming? I might still do it yet but would probably just get a whole set of lifters. Yeah the oil has been in there at least 15 years and only ever ran cold basically. Not to mention the thermost housing and water pump were rusted out. 

you can get the lifters out with head on, but its a tricky job. if it's sat 15yrs  it may come good if it was ok prior
see how it goes after its been run for a while and plan on changing the oil again sooner if you want the best chance.. 

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2 hours ago, deankdx said:

you can get the lifters out with head on, but its a tricky job. if it's sat 15yrs  it may come good if it was ok prior
see how it goes after its been run for a while and plan on changing the oil again sooner if you want the best chance.. 

 

Ok, I'm curious now on how you get the lifters out without taking the head off. Because it really is only one lifter tapping. The rest are all pumped up nicely. But like you said it might come good. In fact, I started yesterday and the oil pressure came straight up too 40+psi (much better than the 20 or less it did have) and there was basically no taping. But, when it heats up a bit, the oil pressure comes back down and starts tick fording again. 

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41 minutes ago, Hgpilot said:

I'm curious now on how you get the lifters out without taking the head of

@Mr Polson might have a link to a Hydraulic Valve Lifter Puller he used? 

i did it bush mechanic style with a ground down coat hanger wire to hook into the hole that lines up with the pushrod oil hole.. needed to work the lifter up and down a fair bit to get the crud to clear so it would come out.. (one is difficult to access, but is possible) 
@Thom might also have a suggestion, 
but you mentioned your Dad was a mechanic, so ask him also

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Ok, I'm curious now on how you get the lifters out without taking the head off. Because it really is only one lifter tapping. The rest are all pumped up nicely. But like you said it might come good. In fact, I started yesterday and the oil pressure came straight up too 40+psi (much better than the 20 or less it did have) and there was basically no taping. But, when it heats up a bit, the oil pressure comes back down and starts tick fording again. 
It's normal for oil pressure to drop as it gets warm. What oil are you using?

[mention=21]Mr Polson[/mention] might have a link to a Hydraulic Valve Lifter Puller he used? 
i did it bush mechanic style with a ground down coat hanger wire to hook into the hole that lines up with the pushrod oil hole.. needed to work the lifter up and down a fair bit to get the crud to clear so it would come out.. (one is difficult to access, but is possible) 
[mention=43]Thom[/mention] might also have a suggestion, 
but you mentioned your Dad was a mechanic, so ask him also
Wouldn't have a link, bought it in person from a local speciality tool shop.
Think it was Toldeo or T&E brand.
That was some time ago and I haven't used it since.

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11 minutes ago, deankdx said:

@Mr Polson might have a link to a Hydraulic Valve Lifter Puller he used? 

i did it bush mechanic style with a ground down coat hanger wire to hook into the hole that lines up with the pushrod oil hole.. needed to work the lifter up and down a fair bit to get the crud to clear so it would come out.. (one is difficult to access, but is possible) 
@Thom might also have a suggestion, 
but you mentioned your Dad was a mechanic, so ask him also

 

Yeah ok I will look into that. Dad is the one who told me to rip the head off and replace all the lifters. I might ask him again and see if he has ever pulled one out without taking the head off. He said he could tell me every thing about a holden 253 but he only ever had to fix 1 falcon in his short time as a mechanic because they never break. 

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19 minutes ago, Mr Polson said:

It's normal for oil pressure to drop as it gets warm. What oil are you using? 

 

Just some 10w-30 Castrol stuff I think it was. Not sure, the old oil did the same though. 

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5 minutes ago, Hgpilot said:

 

Just some 10w-30 Castrol stuff I think it was. Not sure, the old oil did the same though. 

25/50 for old worn out crossflows is better..

 

shell for older engines

this one i think i used in My worst engine.. worked better than the others

4l-helix-hx3-high-mileage-25w-60-high.jp

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Just some 10w-30 Castrol stuff I think it was. Not sure, the old oil did the same though. 
First issue is 10W-30. Bit thin for a crossflow, especially if it's got high kms.

Second issue is Castrol. Has a bit of a reputation for being a sludgy oil.

I personally use Penrite in all my cars, high zinc levels in their HPR oil which is great for older vehicles, and it's Australian.

I'd use either HPR30 or Classic Light if I was you.

https://www.repco.com.au/en/oils-fluids/engine-oils-fluids/engine-oil/penrite-hpr-30-20w-60-5l-hpr30005/p/A7960735

https://www.repco.com.au/en/oils-fluids/engine-oils-fluids/engine-oil/penrite-classic-light-20w-60-engine-oil-5l-clasl005/p/A9307311

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11 minutes ago, Mr Polson said:

First issue is 10W-30. Bit thin for a crossflow, especially if it's got high kms.

Second issue is Castrol. Has a bit of a reputation for being a sludgy oil.

I personally use Penrite in all my cars, high zinc levels in their HPR oil which is great for older vehicles, and it's Australian.

I'd use either HPR30 or Classic Light if I was you.

https://www.repco.com.au/en/oils-fluids/engine-oils-fluids/engine-oil/penrite-hpr-30-20w-60-5l-hpr30005/p/A7960735

https://www.repco.com.au/en/oils-fluids/engine-oils-fluids/engine-oil/penrite-classic-light-20w-60-engine-oil-5l-clasl005/p/A9307311

 

Ok fair enough. I will give this oil a bit of a run through and flush it again and put some heavier weight stuff in. 

 

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If you want to clean up a sludgy engine, use a diesel oil. It has higher amount of detergent to remove and hold soot buildup. Then dump it, add some oil with correct amount of zinc in it and see how it fares.

Hotrodders used to use Shell Rotella as it was an old school diesel oil with good zinc, but they eventually took that out too. So don't go putting that in on the advice of old-timers.

Nowadays, you either have to seek out a correct oil with 1400 ppm of ZDDP (ie race oil, no good for the street) or put a zinc additive into normal oil.

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If you want to clean up a sludgy engine, use a diesel oil. It has higher amount of detergent to remove and hold soot buildup. Then dump it, add some oil with correct amount of zinc in it and see how it fares.

Hotrodders used to use Shell Rotella as it was an old school diesel oil with good zinc, but they eventually took that out too. So don't go putting that in on the advice of old-timers.

Nowadays, you either have to seek out a correct oil with 1400 ppm of ZDDP (ie race oil, no good for the street) or put a zinc additive into normal oil.

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Get customers often doing this with the diesel oil, generally older folk that know about it. They much prefer it over engine flush.

Here's a chart that includes the zinc PPM of Penrite oils, few have more than 1400ea0937ad9a8c60e35c8a08085a00978a.jpg

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Looks like the HPR 30,40 and 50 range is the go for the long haul, but diesel oil just to flush out for maybe 1000k or so.

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