My Clevo build - Thoughts

[ando76 4,354]

Yeah wagoon was just thinking the same thing. That will get me a bit more motivated.

 

Just need some time to work on my own stuff. 

[Thom 6,654]

Amy particular reason you are using open chamber over closed chamber heads?

[blownxd393 25]

Hi, apologies for the 100 questions but you have me wondering, what bore size are you using? And what pistions are you going to have and how many cc on the valve reliefs ?

 

Also what prep are you doing to the conrods or are they just std ? Will the rotating assembly be balanced ?

Do you know how many cc's you have faced your oc heads to and what pistion to deck height are you aiming for or have? Oil pump drive shaft std or hd ?

Is the carby a dp or vac, spread or square bore ?

 

Personally if it were my engine I'd be running 3.5 and up diff gears but not too sure what the intended use for this vehicle is.

I think with 3-1s it may be a bit miss behaved correct me if iam wrong.

 

Thanks Carl

[ando76 4,354]

Thom - Open chamber because that is what I it came with, i.e. correct date stamping- no other reason. 

 

blown xd393 - I actually knocked off the paying job early today and grabbed the clevo from under the bench so I am able to answer most of your questions.

 

• bore is .020 and in good nick - still see x hatch from recent freshen up.
• pistons are standard type by the looks with valve reliefs and will be re-used. Cam does a few tricks on the seats so PTV clearance should not be an issue - but will need to be checked of course.
• conrods are standard but the balancing pads appear to have been touched already so I am suspecting its already balanced.  I will not rev it past 5500 anyway as I'll just grab another gear and use the mountains of torque.
• deck height is a very nasty .060 atm - will be going down to .010. with that and what Cam has planned we will be at 9.8 by Cam's quick calculations today - perfect.
• If the oil pump shaft is showing signs of wear I will replace it with a better unit.
• Carby is a 700 square bore DP - came with the car on the stock manifold with a square to spread adapter. 

Intended use is covered in the first post - final gearing will depend on what I have here as I am sort of on a budget with this one and trying to use stuff I already have - or stuff that came with the car - with the exception of the DUAL POINT distributor - It is going on the Museum shelf in the shed !!!!!

[blownxd393 25]

Good stuff, I appreciate you taking work off early to grab the block out for me for that information. Go grab urself a beer now.

 

Yeah defently want to sort out that deck height and even go to zero depending on what brand those pistions are. Would'nt want to take precious material away from the block that may be needed on a rebuild down the track say for a stroker configuration.

 

One other thing I forgot to ask was what roller rockers are you using ?

 

And do the rods have std bolts or arp ? You can get lucky sometimes. I know you did say your not going to rev it over 5500 in your defense.

 

Enjoy the build it should go fine. Also do tell us what ratio gears you find.

 

Carl

[bear351c 10,273]

.................. with the exception of the DUAL POINT distributor - It is going on the Museum shelf in the shed !!!!!

 

LMAO.....is it a Mallory or Scorcher. Man, haven't seen one of them in years.

[ando76 4,354]

No worries bud - I work for myself so having a play after the paying job is not a problem.  No beer today, It's 'wine' down Wednesday.

 

Roller rockers will be some yella terra's I have lying around here or maybe a set of scorpions if I sell a few more of the treasures I have here. Hmm.

 

I think the rod bolts are standard and if so they will be fine.  I know we all like to replace them and put arp bolts in but sometimes I really wonder about that, especially after speaking to my guru up the hill recently.  He was privy to some arp testing data and some of the stuff he was saying amazed me.  explains why he doesn't use head studs or even main studs on his engines and believe me they are not slow and are extremely reliable.  Try 6 years of Modified production racing without being looked at and class winner in 5 of those years.

 

Might do another 1/2 day tomorrow and rip the centre out. 

 

Bear - unsure of the brand - I'll dig it out tomorrow.  I just remember pulling the cap off and laughing to myself.  This car has soo many 80's cool features on it - like the dual glass 'sun-roof' and centre roof lay back aerial.  Both of which are going.  The donor XA has already lost its roof in preparation for careful removal of 'filler' piece to get rid of the bloody sun roof !!!!

[ando76 4,354]

5.8 litres of Ford goodness



Sump after a quick 3/4 can squirt of supercrap degreaser



Interesting place to scribe a Job no. As best as I can work out the engine was re-built by RPM engines many years ago. I did a bit of net research after finding their tag on the alloy rocker covers - with the obligatory 80's long wing nut studs holding them down of course.

 

Turns out the old fella from RPM engines finally retired 6 years ago and a new fella had taken over the business and changed name - but kept the old phone number. Unfortunately all the old job cards got thrown out so no idea what is in this thing. I'll pull the balancer tomorrow and get the cam out to see if there is any surprises there. It has stock rockers atm so not expecting anything to awesome.
 

[bear351c 10,273]

Cool stuff. Never had an issue with rod bolts, either.  As you've said, it's not a drag car, just a daily. Keep us posted with all the goodies, including the chrome rocker cover wing nuts..............Bwah ha ha ha ha...

[ando76 4,354]

Just for you Bear - Get this piece of 80's cool into ya...

 

[ando76 4,354]

So I sort of had another slack day on the paying job today as I had a bit of stuff to do at home so I didn't get into the shed till late and I knew I had to go to the dyno later that arvo to tune a race car so I thought stuff it - Clevo time.

 

pulled a couple of pistons and checked ring end gap. pretty happy with the results but I'll be throwing a new set at it as well as new bearings as the top side of the conrod bearing were a little marked. Going to check the conrod tunnel for roundness due to this discovery.

 

 

 

also checked the deck height from front to back on both sides and top and bottom of the piston and all is in order there so it just needs a .050" hair cut and all will be good.

 

The pistons are ACL and are in great condition

 

So tomorrow I might just check the clearance on the big ends and the mains and if they are all good - just the block will be heading down to Cam. I am trying very hard to resist the temptation to go all out of this engine and get it balanced etc. etc. but I know what will happen - it will turn into mechanical roller cam - alloy heads yadda yadda. Need to show restraint.

[blownxd393 25]

Good work. Keep the photos and infomation coming, your right it does look like the engine was only just built recently.

 

 

With that wear mark on the rod brg I would be checking for taper on that crank journal too,check for sign of anything under the brg in that spot. Do you know what rod side clearence it had ? Also knowing the previous crank end float helps for the next build up.

 

If your rods big end journals do need re-sizing then I'd be fitting arp bolts whilst your at it just for peice and mind.

 

Hopefully just a deck facing and a nice quick hone to bed the new rings and some new brgs your set.

 

Have the heads been inserted ?

[ando76 4,354]

I did check rod side clearance by moving it by hand - no measuring tool used and it was fine. 

 

If there was taper on the crank the big end bearing would have even wear the whole way around the bearing wouldn't it?  I'm not overly worried about the wear- in my experience its pretty normal topside wear - just need to check. 

 

I did not check end float - but I will have a look at the thrust to see what is going on there.  I will most likely be using King bearings on the rebuild over ACL as I have found them to be ace in my race motors. 

 

Of course end float will be checked when I rebuild.  With the general quality that seems to have occurred on its last freshen up (nice clean bearing showing that the engine was actually cleaned properly before being assembled) I am not expecting any dramas. 

 

The camshaft had no part no. on the end and looks to be standard so I would say that the last rebuild was just a stock refresh.  All in all so far so good and a excellent base for a stout hydraulic cam hot street motor I do believe.

[gerg 10,871]

That is a very odd wear mark, most probable cause is like you say a bit of shit under the bearing, even perhaps a bruise from impacting something when it was in bits. I've learnt from buying an already "rebuilt" engine that you're buying other people's (unknown) workmanship. Only way to be sure is to do it all yourself

[ando76 4,354]

Yeah mate - my very first clevo and I'm loving them.  Don't get me wrong there are areas of improvement for those of us that like to push things beyond their normal design purpose but they are a legendary engine in my eyes. 

 

I grew up watching DJ at Bathurst and I still remember the rumble of GRUNT, my uncle's XE ESP.  As Sly has told me more than once - they have the best note of any V8 - and I tend to agree.

 

No work on the Clevo today but I did clear up a couple of things.  mate came over so with his help I was able to determine the diff ratio.  3.0 and yes it is the original LSD centre.  Score.

 

The other day when I pulled the carb off the inlet manifold I noticed that the 'adapter' (square to spreadbore) was actually just a 1" open spacer.  I checked the holes in the manifold and with my complete lack of knowledge of all things Clevo, I just set it aside for further thought another day.  But it got the better of me today and I noticed that the inlet tract on the manifold was huge - way bigger than the 2v heads.

 

Lucky the mate that came over was a XY-XC Ford tragic and he confirmed straight away that it was a 4v GT inlet manifold.  Now why if was on this engine with 2v heads has me troubled as I, my mate and Pogo had never heard of that combination - ever.  Truly weird shit.

 

My Ford made mate then decided to scrape off the crud on the lower leaf spring plates and there stamped on them was GT.  He also sorted out the rear section of the exhaust - which had been troubling me.  Looks like someone has taken the factory rear mounts and removed them from the inside of the chassis rails and welded them on the outside to get the exhaust to run outboard of the leaf springs. 

 

Easy fix - cut the welds off and bolt them back into the original location - but this may trouble my plans to run resonators at the rear so it looks like Hookers in the factory location and then 2.5 straight out the back.  should make for a nice noise. 

 

Oh I'm getting a little excited. 

[blownxd393 25]

The 4v manifold on a 2v is an old school 80s trick iam lead to believe worth 30hp. For the life of me iam not sure how with the huge step.

 

Seen it a few times and even where ppl port blend them.

 

Now the good news for you is that if you sell it you may have some cash to fit an Edelbrock air gap ® with out being too out of pocket. (check the cast numbers and Google is your friend)

[ando76 4,354]

yeah the step would be the wrong way but stranger things have happened. 

 

My mate is pretty keen on the manifold so I will probably swap it for the edelbrock performer that I want.  No air gap going on this engine - It will spoil any chance of pulling off the 'stock' look. 

 

With that video link from Sly, it seems I can get air gap performance from the performer. 

[blownxd393 25]

Yeah iam on the same page. Performer it is.

[ando76 4,354]

Yeah mate- Cam and I have settled on the package and with the performer I will get what I want in both performance and almost stock look.  win win.

[waynegrovs 1]

sounds a good combo but think of changing inlet to an airgap edelbrock

[Trev Vaa 1,185]

hey mate

just a tip, if you want to make it easy to drive, and easy to cruise with, go 3.25s in the ass with that combo

but get a WIDE ratio gearset for the toploader, will make it perfectly driveable on the street, nice and cruisy on the highway and the lower first and second gear will mean you can stomp it and not worry about it bogging down.

 

i'd say your bang on track with the combo you listed, should be really nice to drive, any idea what the heads will flow?

oh instead of isky, i use PSI springs, never had an issue with one, even after 5 years.

[Trev Vaa 1,185]

oh as far as RPM goes, i know the old boy, if you really want to find out the details i can contact him, he is in his 70s or 80s though.

[ando76 4,354]

Thanks mate, but I love my iskys as much as u love your PSI springs. The 295ds are crackers, they are 'Tool Room' springs. Bloody awesome bits of kit. 5 years of consistent high rpm in speedway engines and only ever lose like 2-3 pounds.

I'm hearing you on the gears. I'll probably just put it together with the 3.0's and with the top loader I have. I need to check the ratio in my other 9" tho as just to know.

Head flow will be decent knowing Cam. I'll chuck them on the bench as soon as I get them back and post the figures.

Thanks again for the info and just leave the old fella from RPM. Sounds like he has earned his retirement.

[Trev Vaa 1,185]

yeh 3.0:1 with the wide ratio toploader will be fine dude, still plenty of punch off the line. found the ratios online:

close: 2.32 1.69 1.29 1

wide: 2.78 1.93 1.36 1

 

slotting a wide ratio with 3.0:1 in the ass will have a similar first gear to a close ratio with 3.5:1 in the back, it'll actually be a touch shorter

 

yep isky has a reputation for quality thats for sure. definitely top quality.

[ando76 4,354]

Ok not sure what top loader mine is. I'll do some research when I return from holidays. Thanks again