4 speed single rail info

[408WPN 41]

 Hey Guy's 

Looking through OZ Falcon & single rail gearbox history comes up but can't seem to locate number below ending in 016.

Scored this 4 speed today ,comes with drive shaft, pedal box ,Bell housing, clutch cable & fork, X member & mount. $1800 NZD

Was in a XE with a 302 cleveland & are planning on putting it in my XF FAIRMONT 351 CLEVELAND with 3.23 ratio diff. 

I tried to download video of gear box but but was a no go,clean oil & good cogs etc. 

Any info though on that tag number.

Photo of that Brake booster I think I need that also if memory serves me right from auto conversion to manual 

 

Cheers  

 

[deankxf 20,979]

25 minutes ago, 408WPN said:

Any info though on that tag number.

Photo of that Brake booster I think I need that also if memory serves me right from auto conversion to manual 

 

Cheers

 

@Thom might have some idea on the single rail number, but if it came on a 302, it will have ratios similar to the 6cyl ones.  only the 351 had the tall 1st gear. (close ratio)

 

either way, the box is otherwise the same, will handle the power, and 3.23 isn't too extreme for the normally 2.92 ratio the other boxes had (351 used the 3.23 ratio only from memory)

 

the brake booster that causes issues is only on the fairlane and LTD from my memory, it's a big diameter one that blocks the mounting for the clutch master.  the 6cyl one will be fine. 

[408WPN 41]

10 hours ago, deankxf said:

 

@Thom might have some idea on the single rail number, but if it came on a 302, it will have ratios similar to the 6cyl ones.  only the 351 had the tall 1st gear. (close ratio)

 

either way, the box is otherwise the same, will handle the power, and 3.23 isn't too extreme for the normally 2.92 ratio the other boxes had (351 used the 3.23 ratio only from memory)

 

the brake booster that causes issues is only on the fairlane and LTD from my memory, it's a big diameter one that blocks the mounting for the clutch master.  the 6cyl one will be fine. 

Thanks as always for the info Dean  

It's a shame Oz falcon can't upload a few of my images & also had a short video of the gearbox with the top cover off going through the gears. 

Another couple of questions if you're in the know haha . 

Looking at the video noticed the clutch fork in the bell housing is on the right hand side, that shouldn't matter aye,,just wondering if that gets in the way of the headers, start motor that side also, abit going on by the looks. 

[2redrovers 21,898]

Images and videos need to be hosted elsewhere and linked into your posts to show here. This is the same policy for everyone and has been from the beginning. It keeps our footprint down and therefore the costs involved in hosting the forum to a minimum.

For mobile use, the tapatalk app is the easiest way to upload photos. I use an old version of the app which has no daily limits on posting etc, downside is I get no notifications but that doesn't matter much to me. For video, use YouTube to upload then post the link in your thread to share. You can also use other sites like imgur to host photos. There is a thread showing how to do this on the forum (look at Dean's signature for link)

[dvfalcon 375]

As Dean said first gear is the only difference. They don't like to much of a hard time you will rip the gear stick thread out the top of the gearbox, or break the selector fork. They also hard on the seal on the selector shaft as they are all well worn. there are different versions of the output housing on other model cars

Dale

[408WPN 41]

7 minutes ago, dvfalcon said:

As Dean said first gear is the only difference. They don't like to much of a hard time you will rip the gear stick thread out the top of the gearbox, or break the selector fork. They also hard on the seal on the selector shaft as they are all well worn. there are different versions of the output housing on other model cars

Dale

Thanks,so really not to much of a bigger deal & nothing seriously putting off from doing the conversion .

Few yrs ago went the full Monty on a Tremec TKX 5 spd behind a 408w XF ute. 

 

[deankxf 20,979]

7 hours ago, 408WPN said:

Thanks,so really not to much of a bigger deal & nothing seriously putting off from doing the conversion .

Few yrs ago went the full Monty on a Tremec TKX 5 spd behind a 408w XF ute. 

Sorry i've been out all day, 

 

the clutch fork on the drivers side is odd, I've never seen a cable type V8 single rail bell housing, but that's likely what it is. 

does it have a mount for the hydraulic slave on the passenger side? that's usually where the V8 ones were, with a push fork (compact)

 

yeah as dvfalcon mentioned, change the selector shaft seal at minimum, you'll need to remove the extension housing to change it, after knocking the roll pin out of the remote shifter shaft. 

the gearsticks can pull out, but there are many aftermarket repair kits now, and some in brass which weren't around when i had single rails. (should be nice) also someone here (newer member last year) posted that they do a short shift kit for them also. 

 

i actually like these boxes, but when i slapped a second hand one behind my almost stock 351 i blew it up in a couple of weeks, got another and blew that up in days, and another went noisy in a week.. so had one fully rebuild and it didn't die with 80,000 HARD kms , so i'd suggest putting bearings in it at minimum.  ( i was told to use motor oil in mine, but the book said to use trans fluid, so who knows what/if there's any difference in them in that regard?)

[408WPN 41]

18 hours ago, deankxf said:

Sorry i've been out all day, 

 

the clutch fork on the drivers side is odd, I've never seen a cable type V8 single rail bell housing, but that's likely what it is. 

does it have a mount for the hydraulic slave on the passenger side? that's usually where the V8 ones were, with a push fork (compact)

 

yeah as dvfalcon mentioned, change the selector shaft seal at minimum, you'll need to remove the extension housing to change it, after knocking the roll pin out of the remote shifter shaft. 

the gearsticks can pull out, but there are many aftermarket repair kits now, and some in brass which weren't around when i had single rails. (should be nice) also someone here (newer member last year) posted that they do a short shift kit for them also. 

 

i actually like these boxes, but when i slapped a second hand one behind my almost stock 351 i blew it up in a couple of weeks, got another and blew that up in days, and another went noisy in a week.. so had one fully rebuild and it didn't die with 80,000 HARD kms , so i'd suggest putting bearings in it at minimum.  ( i was told to use motor oil in mine, but the book said to use trans fluid, so who knows what/if there's any difference in them in that regard?)

No worries Dean. 

 

I'm leaning towards just on selling the combo deal I got.

If you're on Facebook I got quite abit of feedback from a post from the group below. 

 

[deankxf 20,979]

7 hours ago, 408WPN said:

No worries Dean. 

 

I'm leaning towards just on selling the combo deal I got.

If you're on Facebook I got quite abit of feedback from a post from the group below. 

 

I'll skip joining another group, 
there's often a lot of smart helpful people on these private facebook groups, so you probably got some valid feedback. 

 

the single rail i used was from a cortina, i had to swap the extension housing to the falcon type, i chose it because it had the easiest 1st gear for the 2.92 diff gears i had. (i had a 351 single rail on a 250 crossflow years earlier, and 1st gear with the 2.92 diff seemed to go close to 80kmh, but it was a hard start on a hill. 

 

hard to know what box i'd choose these days, all manuals are rare, worn and expensive. 

 

[408WPN 41]

8 hours ago, deankxf said:

 

I'll skip joining another group, 
there's often a lot of smart helpful people on these private facebook groups, so you probably got some valid feedback. 

 

the single rail i used was from a cortina, i had to swap the extension housing to the falcon type, i chose it because it had the easiest 1st gear for the 2.92 diff gears i had. (i had a 351 single rail on a 250 crossflow years earlier, and 1st gear with the 2.92 diff seemed to go close to 80kmh, but it was a hard start on a hill. 

 

hard to know what box i'd choose these days, all manuals are rare, worn and expensive. 

 

I'm pretty sure this one I've bought is now from a 6cyl Cortina also but 80km/hr in first from 351 gearbox sounds awesome. 

To begin with knowing that it was behind a 302c sounded like the go & the whole complete combo I snapped it up before someone else. 

Also admittedly got a bit confused with the toploaders thinking the single rail a close 2nd & then all the work involved doing the conversion, plus certification it would suck badly if the box went bang .

There's a rebuilt E series XR8 T5 over here on Trademe plus same seller has a new WC T5 combo but is asking 8k,long way off the $1800 I've just paid. 

 

 

[deankxf 20,979]

2 hours ago, 408WPN said:

There's a rebuilt E series XR8 T5 over here on Trademe plus same seller has a new WC T5 combo but is asking 8k,long way off the $1800 I've just paid. 

E series XR8 would likely put the gear stick back further, and require a fair pain in the ass. the V8 e series box has a much longer input shaft than the single rail/top loader.

there's a thread or 2 here where people have fitted the T5 from XF to EL (EB onwards are better/with synchro on reverse)
and i've had one also on a 6cyl bell housing, 
that would be how i'd go into an X sereis, 

it comprises Top loader or single rail bell housing, clutch/flywheel,  and modding the bell housing a bit (few different ways, also Castlemaine Rod Shop did a bell housing also back in the day, still available, not sure what it translates to NZ dollarydoos with postage and conversion 
https://www.rodshop.com.au/bellhousing-kit-gearbox-ford-t5-6-cyl-engine-cleve )

check this thread out, there should be links to others
 

 

[408WPN 41]

34 minutes ago, deankxf said:

E series XR8 would likely put the gear stick back further, and require a fair pain in the ass. the V8 e series box has a much longer input shaft than the single rail/top loader.

there's a thread or 2 here where people have fitted the T5 from XF to EL (EB onwards are better/with synchro on reverse)
and i've had one also on a 6cyl bell housing, 
that would be how i'd go into an X sereis, 

it comprises Top loader or single rail bell housing, clutch/flywheel,  and modding the bell housing a bit (few different ways, also Castlemaine Rod Shop did a bell housing also back in the day, still available, not sure what it translates to NZ dollarydoos with postage and conversion 
https://www.rodshop.com.au/bellhousing-kit-gearbox-ford-t5-6-cyl-engine-cleve )

check this thread out, there should be links to others
 

 

Thanks Dean. 

Still  tweaking my brain hard out with different options I can take,one thing I've come across narrowing down the configuration of the single rail I've purchased is the spline on the input shaft with the V8 mainly being 10 spline & 6cyl 20 or 21 spline & I doubt whoever over the years & are assuming they didn't go the hassle of replacing the input shaft to begin with ,which in turn would narrow down my first gear ratio being to high .

I have ruled out the idea of the E SERIES T5 though,  as he wants $6500 but another idea which is pretty good is go ahead with the conversion & if it shits itself then replace it with a toploader which is relatively easy to drill the bell housing to fit & the tail shaft is apparently the same length as the single rail so in turn won't have any hassle incurring with the drive shaft. Top loader come up every now & then for good money but no cheap one's over here at the moment & they're all asking about 4k

Xe drive shaft is included with the deal & that should just bolt straight into my XF with no drama over the length 

[deankxf 20,979]

52 minutes ago, 408WPN said:

Xe drive shaft is included with the deal & that should just bolt straight into my XF with no drama over the length 

 

XB to XF sedan tailshafts would be the same for bw35,bw40 (auto) C4/C10, single rail and T5 manual.. you'd be able to use yours. 

FMX and top loader have different spline count on the tailshaft yoke.. 

 

52 minutes ago, 408WPN said:

one thing I've come across narrowing down the configuration of the single rail I've purchased is the spline on the input shaft with the V8 mainly being 10 spline & 6cyl 20 or 21 spline & I doubt whoever over the years & are assuming they didn't go the hassle of replacing the input shaft to begin with

 

clutch splines are the same from my understanding single rail to T5 (not sure on the V8 one but betting it's same) 

the 3 speed had different splines into the clutch (input) and the top loader one might be different?(no idea) 

6cyl didn't have 20 spline input, well unless the sigma style 3.3 litre box had that much on it, it's super rare by comparison and is bolted to the bell housing from the inside .. and would barely handle a 250 crossflow let alone a V8.. 

[408WPN 41]

22 minutes ago, deankxf said:

 

XB to XF sedan tailshafts would be the same for bw35,bw40 (auto) C4/C10, single rail and T5 manual.. you'd be able to use yours. 

FMX and top loader have different spline count on the tailshaft yoke.. 

 

 

clutch splines are the same from my understanding single rail to T5 (not sure on the V8 one but betting it's same) 

the 3 speed had different splines into the clutch (input) and the top loader one might be different?(no idea) 

6cyl didn't have 20 spline input, well unless the sigma style 3.3 litre box had that much on it, it's super rare by comparison and is bolted to the bell housing from the inside .. and would barely handle a 250 crossflow let alone a V8.. 

That screenshot has the info that I was going off. 

Been talking to the bloke on bought the package off, feeling confident gonna be OK & have now done a deal for the Flywheel, pressure plate etc that the previous owner offered him 

[deankxf 20,979]

4 minutes ago, 408WPN said:

That screenshot has the info that I was going off. 

Been talking to the bloke on bought the package off, feeling confident gonna be OK & have now done a deal for the Flywheel, pressure plate etc that the previous owner offered him 

I'd disagree with that screenshot info

wonder if @Thom or @SPArKy_Dave could help confirm it,

 

they are all same as whatever a T5 is (pretty sure it's 10 spline) 

[408WPN 41]

31 minutes ago, deankxf said:

I'd disagree with that screenshot info

wonder if @Thom or @SPArKy_Dave could help confirm it,

 

they are all same as whatever a T5 is (pretty sure it's 10 spline) 

Was off the very detailed post Sparky had put up a number of years ago 

[deankxf 20,979]

2 minutes ago, 408WPN said:

Was off the very detailed post Sparky had put up a number of years ago 

odd, 

i've never seen a different clutch plate needed unless it was for the 3 speed or the rubbish 3.3gearboxes (mitsubishi sigma box in 4 or 5 speed i believe )

i'd just count the one on yours

[408WPN 41]

4 minutes ago, deankxf said:

odd, 

i've never seen a different clutch plate needed unless it was for the 3 speed or the rubbish 3.3gearboxes (mitsubishi sigma box in 4 or 5 speed i believe )

i'd just count the one on yours

 

[deankxf 20,979]

3 minutes ago, 408WPN said:

 

i had a quick look through that,

 

I've never known one to be different, but anything's possible with Ford i guess. 

[SPArKy_Dave 9,314]

On 4/16/2025 at 1:49 PM, deankxf said:

i had a quick look through that,

 

I've never known one to be different, but anything's possible with Ford i guess. 

 

Looking at the Exedy website,

all the single rails (even 3speed) are 10 spline on the clutch friction plate

3speeds just have a smaller diameter shaft at 24mm, over 27.5mm

 

The info regarding 19/20/21/22 splines, relates to the opposite end of the input shaft, internal to the gearbox?

 

First screenshot is all XD, and XE up to 05/82

Second screenshot is XE only, from 05/82

 

 

 

 

 

 

[SPArKy_Dave 9,314]

On 4/13/2025 at 8:30 PM, 408WPN said:

 Hey Guy's 

Looking through OZ Falcon & single rail gearbox history comes up but can't seem to locate number below ending in 016.

 

A 78DA-7003-AB gearbox, is from an 81' onwards XD

They were used in either 3.3/4.1 or 4.9 XD's, possibly very early XE's.

Shorter ratio gearbox, I believe