gerg 10,871 Posted September 8, 2015 Actually you need to chop the graphs off to where the relevant info starts because looking at the tps in the 2nd one, it doesn't start till 1/2 way through the log and the 1st one ends at about 1/2 way. This might be what is confusing you. Doesn't help that they've used the same colour for 3 different functions on each graph. Both seem to climb slowly in boost after it initially plateaus, suggesting as I mentioned before, an insufficiently sized wastegate. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Butcha 111 Posted September 8, 2015 44mm wastegate not enough then. Does boost ceep become less of a problem at higher pressures ie i wind it up until the rollover point is at 14psi? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gerg 10,871 Posted September 9, 2015 I've got no idea about methanol and its exhaust volume requirements, but I'm assuming it needs more exhaust size for the equivalent hp to petrol? If so, this might explain the 44mm being too small, even though it isn't exactly tiny by average standards. At that hp level, and on methanol, maybe it is too small. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gerg 10,871 Posted September 9, 2015 Boost creep is simply the wastegate's inability to dump after reaching a certain amount of exhaust flow. Instead of the excess exhaust going through the wastegate, it is forced through the turbine, causing a rise in turbine pressure and thus boost pressure. So yes, if you hold the wastegate closed for longer (ie opens at a higher boost pressure) then the wastegate's ability to flow is irrelevant until it opens. You may benefit from a simple inline boost control valve that acts like a mini blowoff. It stops boost signal from reaching the wastegate actuator until a prescribed amount of boost is reached. It is handy if your actuator spring is a bit hit-and-miss. It has a tendency to eliminate wastegate creep (opening too early) and lets the power come on harder. XPTCrossy has one on his Supra and with his old turbo, it hit boost about 500 rpm earlier once fitted. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ando76 4,354 Posted September 9, 2015 I would say with the meth and relatively high compression for boost that the wastegate could be compromised. But I must admit my boost experience is very limited so I would listed to gerg and XPT crossy. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
XPT 673 Posted September 9, 2015 44mm is a decent size gate, I wouldn't have thought it to be a problem. I'd be checking the boost reference line for leaks, otherwise the wastegate diaphragm could be spilt/leaking. You can bench test it with compressed air, checking that it's opening properly. To test for internal leaks you charge the boost reference line connected to the wastegate with regulated (to spring pressure) compressed air with a ball valve and pressure gauge. Once wastegate cracks open shut the valve and watch the guage. It should hold pressure. Barring that, do you have the boost reference line on the correct port? It looks like you might have the reference hose on the spring side of the diaphragm on top looking at your page 2 pic anyway. It should be on the opposite side of the diaphragm working against the spring towards the middle of the actuator. If that is all good then perhaps the wastegate feed angle on the manifold is on the sharp side. 3 ando76, Butcha and gerg reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Butcha 111 Posted September 10, 2015 I'll do the checks you suggested. The reference line runs from the right angle thingmebob on turbo outlet through to the port bottom of the wastegate. As i understand the top port is for if you have a boost controller to manage boost. Ill see if i can find a better pic of the wastegate see what yous reckon. It just worries me as i added .5psi of boost an the thing creeps 11psi. Might have to get a 60mm wastegate to tame the beast. I dont mind turning the boost to 10 to 14psi but if its gonna creep to 20+ we got issues. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Butcha 111 Posted September 10, 2015 . http://vimeo.com/138830755 Thought id chuck up a vid of what the injector looks like@ 7000rpm 60% duty cycle 1000 pulses. Oh and a pic of the head i torched 2 meetings ago. 4 ricktewagon, gerg, wagoon and 1 other reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Butcha 111 Posted September 20, 2015 Game over. Raced sat night and had an awesome first heat lead start to finish. However 1 lap from finish she didnt seem to pull as hard not that i was pushing it then just before i crossed the finish i heard it flame and started missing so i shut er down... the result Checking everything out and found injector on that pot flowing 200ml where the others were 350ml. Really shits me cause everything else was mint. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ando76 4,354 Posted September 21, 2015 fek . big hole. not good brother 1 Butcha reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Butcha 111 Posted September 21, 2015 Yeah not wrong. I got a standard efi bottom end i might put in just change over oil pump and cam. Dunno whether to keep on the efi path as it pretty much there and is almost sorted or i have a meth carby just get a carb hat and go blow through...dumb it down nice and simple.. I have made a video with in car footage and the datalog overlay giving rpm, boost and, throttle position which ill put up when it uploads.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Xelisty 366 Posted September 21, 2015 Nice video and great quality. Good on you for getting the footage. Superb Bad luck with the engine and good luck with the build Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 1 Butcha reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gerg 10,871 Posted September 21, 2015 Shit never heard of an injector doing that... Could the methanol be perishing your fuel hoses/rail, and little chunks breaking off? I recently had a blocked squirter in my holley with what looked like a tiny chunk of rubber hose. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gerg 10,871 Posted September 21, 2015 Nice footage, never seen this kind of racing from that angle. Goes to show how much balls this thing has.... You don't seem to hit 100% throttle at all (if that's throttle I'm looking at) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Butcha 111 Posted September 21, 2015 Yeah its TPS. Track was really heavy and there was a wet spot at the bottom of turn 4 i was trying to avoid. Caught me out a few times on turn in the car hooked and settled a bit early and i had to back off and go again. I dropped my gear ratio down an with the heavy track i was using alot more throttle than i otherwise would. I never got any junk out of the injector but it doesnt seem to have any filter or buckets in them. Maybe i was suppost to put em in? Injector was straight from bosch? I will be getting another wastegate to pin the boost to 12. I kinda liked how it creeps though the more peddle the more boost so i can take what i need. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gerg 10,871 Posted September 22, 2015 Never seen an injector without a screen but never ordered new ones from manufacturer either. Weird though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Butcha 111 Posted August 1, 2016 sooo i got bored and thought id give this another crack. Few changes for version 2. Bigger turbo and blow through, refine a few thing, Will be keeping the ecu for logging purposes. Looking to log individual EGT's as well to help keep on top of things. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ando76 4,354 Posted August 2, 2016 Great news mate. Glad your back at it. Jake Edwards doing your blow thru carb? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Butcha 111 Posted August 2, 2016 Who? Nar havin a crack at it meself ando done bit of research. I got the gist of what needs to be done. See if i can make it work. Sent from my SM-G928I using Tapatalk Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ando76 4,354 Posted August 2, 2016 Jake Edwards in Canberra mate. Absolute jet on blow thru carbs. Held Summernats records for years with his blow thru turbo stuff. Still doing it now with more modern gear. But with a bit of research I'm sure you are more than capable. Be good to see the big falcon going around again. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Butcha 111 Posted August 2, 2016 yeh be good to chuck a roost again. Ive got ahold of a T04z style turbo that has 11 blade 66m billet wheel on it with 80trim vs the 61mm 60 trim and a 1.00 housing vs the .86 i got on it. Extreme velocity carb hat going on to..ahem my quickfuel 950 meth carb off me v8 for the time being till i track down a 750 or the like. into my 4 barrel cain/redline/whatever it is manifold. Ill need to change orientation of the carb east/west. Same cam and head from last time. Pipes will be wrapped and turbo blanket on. The bottom end is a lower compression efi donk with dished pistons around 9:1 or so with the shaved head. boost will be around the 15 to 20 mark. exhaust to be changed to 4" bout it. should make more power overall and be a bit more reliable than the efi setup. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ando76 4,354 Posted August 2, 2016 Nice. Be fun on boost out of the corners. Yahoo Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Butcha 111 Posted August 3, 2016 Chasing a .020 acl race series piston if anyone has leftovers that is still usable from a blown up engine. The bottom end that i blew the arse out of one piston has e series rods,arp bolts and the block has been o ringed and grouted so id like to resuse that if i can. Otherwise ill try and chase .030 pistons. Sent from my SM-G928I using Tapatalk I should add they are 3.9 rods ea/b? Ill check when i get home. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ando76 4,354 Posted August 3, 2016 What size dish mate? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
