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Travis

Temperature

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14 hours ago, Travis said:


After I drive it i can put my hand on one side of the radiator and its getting close to being warm, where the other side is to hot to touch,red devil radiators said that is a thermostat problem,

 

What radiator is in there now?

 

Which side is getting hot? Upper Radiator hose tank, or the lower one?

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15 hours ago, Travis said:


After I drive it i can put my hand on one side of the radiator and its getting close to being warm, where the other side is to hot to touch,red devil radiators said that is a thermostat problem,


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i was told that's a sign of a blocked radiator, but it could be a trait of a triple flow radiator? 

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I have the same Aussie dessert coolers radiator in it, I had it cut open and cleaned out so it’s not blocked, I went for a drive yesterday and it stayed under 90 degrees for 20min, but started going up so I went home, I think I will try getting the mufflers checked out and then a good tune, but if that doesn’t fix it I think I will just sell it, a $6000 motor upgrade has become closer to $10k so I need to draw a line,


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So I just rung Aussie dessert coolers to ask if the radiator was a single flow or double or triple, he said it’s only a single flow just with a bigger tank, if I was to try say a pwr triple flow radiator, what do you guys think? I would like all your opinions before I do anything more,


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If your radiator is clean and not blocked then I wouldn’t spend more money on another radiator until I’d finished investigating the bypass and thermostat.


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On 3/29/2019 at 10:12 AM, Travis said:

what to do now


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I'd be waiting till the new thermostat turned up, i'd consider getting the car on a dyno to see what it does and if it's tuned right and if the temperature gauge is even accurate.

i'd not sell it, because you'd lose heaps.. if you can do some research finding someone that knows whats going on you'll be able to enjoy it. i hated My clevo, and working on BGDAV's one has brought memories of it.. but i had a dyno bloke sort mine and it did 80,000kms pretty much only needing oil, filters and spark plugs. 
i did a lot of highway driving, and corners, and the crossflow 6 was better for both. just didn't sound as good. i had crossflows for near 20yrs after that clevo. (I had a 1UZ in a falcon about 10yrs ago,  in my opinion that engine is better in every single detail other than sound at idle.. couldn't hear it)

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1 hour ago, bear351c said:

Why did you hate your Clevo.?  I've had heaps of them, and always walked away with a chubby.  

between the 6 or so My Dad, brother  mate and myself they were always running hot in summer in traffic, used 50% more fuel than a crossflow that did 90% the same otherwise. made the car handle worse because of the big heavy lump of iron, bastard to work on, especially with air con and lpg.

i probably had a bad run compared to crossflows.

they make a nice noise. that's about the only good thing i can say about them personally. 

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between the 6 or so My Dad, brother  mate and myself they were always running hot in summer in traffic, used 50% more fuel than a crossflow that did 90% the same otherwise. made the car handle worse because of the big heavy lump of iron, bastard to work on, especially with air con and lpg.
i probably had a bad run compared to crossflows.
they make a nice noise. that's about the only good thing i can say about them personally. 


I can relate to some points you made there, perhaps to a lesser extent but valid all the same.

A stock, all-iron clevo with all the other heavy shit that goes with it does make for a lardy beast, especially with a dual system, FMX or toploaders and 9" but suspension can be tuned around that to a degree. It would easily add 150 kg to the car. Engine-for-engine, the Clevo outweighs the alloy Crossy by about 80Kg.

Running hot: mine is really not bad in that way, and my cooling system is nothing special. Alan Moffat said that his XY ran nice and cool even with that beer carton sucked into the front. I think the later smogged-up black motors with retarded everything had trouble in that area particularly with AC fitted. Low comp open chambers didn't help either. They can benefit by bumping up base timing by heaps. You can hear it in the exhaust. Much more clean and mellow. People also piss off the vac advance but that's not a smart move. That is your cruise efficiency gone in an instant.

Fuel consumption: sure there are many accounts of how badly these things drink (302 and 351) but remember this design is a de-tuned race engine, and this especially can be said of the 4V. Go shoving in a big stupid cam and the low-rpm efficiency goes out the window, more so than usual. These engines need to be built differently from your Chevs and Windsors. The closed chambers handle good comp, so you should take advantage of that. Using stock intake and an average carby, I'd get consistent 15s to the 100, occasionally dipping into the 14s. Not too bad for an old clunker. Crossys tend to get around the 12 mark, 11 on a trip, EFI maybe 10s, high 9s.

Crossys , being a long-stroke motor compared to the short-stroke clevo (especially 302), gives them great low-rpm torque, which is where you spend most of the time when you're not giving it some welly. The clevo doesn't really come into its prime until above 3000, which is also where it will start to drink.

All that said, Ford dumped them for a reason... they were just too hard to get day-to-day efficiency out of.h

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3 hours ago, gerg said:

Using stock intake and an average carby, I'd get consistent 15s to the 100, occasionally dipping into the 14s. Not too bad for an old clunker. Crossys tend to get around the 12 mark, 11 on a trip, EFI maybe 10s, high 9s.

the XE S pack i had on petrol(later converted to gas) was 250 and 4 speed single rail used to get 10Litres per hundred on petrol. 

the late XF ute i had on petrol got 11 litres per 100 for the week i drove it before converting to lpg. 
all crossflows i have had got 15L per 100 of LPG without trying. 

 

My 351 had a 2 core radiator, was on its limit in traffic on high 30s days. 

 

 

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My XF wagon full of work gear, used to get me 16L/100km around town consistently.

With a worn out Weber carb...

 

My e-series 6cyl wagon was about 17-18L/100km, till I fitted a new O2 sensor.

Then it dropped to 13-15L/100km around town, 9-10 on the open rd.

I feel there's a tiny bit more in it, if I refurb the injectors.

 

My e-series V8 wagon, is around 15-17L/100km around town, and 11-12 on the freeway.

I've done nothing to the fuel system, but I pretty sure it needs O2 sensors at the very least...

 

The old man's 5ltr Commodore ute, is consistently in the 20-25L/100km bracket.

 

All vehicles running 91 octane.

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all crossflows i have had got 15L per 100 of LPG without trying. 
 
My 351 had a 2 core radiator, was on its limit in traffic on high 30s days.

Same as my Corty. 15 to the hunge all day every day, city or highway.

My radiator was only a heavy duty copper 6 cyl but probably the same as a V8. Running EF theromos, never cooked except started to creep up on high 30s days stuck in traffic. Never boiled.

 
My e-series 6cyl wagon was about 17-18L/100km, till I fitted a new O2 sensor. Then it dropped to 13-15L/100km around town, 9-10 on the open rd. I feel there's a tiny bit more in it, if I refurb the injectors.

All vehicles running 91 octane.


I'm in an EL wagon doing mid 13s/low 14s, mostly suburban driving. I find that the power/eco switch makes no difference to economy as the lower shift points just put the converter into more slippage and wasted power. What it really needs is a lower lockup point, say 50-60 km/h.

My fuel figures are all with E10 (including the Clevo).



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10 hours ago, gerg said:

What it really needs is a lower lockup point, say 50-60 km/h.
 

 

The EF's have a 70km/h lockup in 4th econ, and 60km/h in 4th power.

Not sure on early EL 6cyl.

The late EL hybrids (early 98 onwards) 6cyl and AU's, have a 60km/h lockup in econ.

 

The EL V8's of any year, have a 60km/h lockup also in econ.

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I'm in an EL wagon doing mid 13s/low 14s, mostly suburban driving. I find that the power/eco switch makes no difference to economy as the lower shift points just put the converter into more slippage and wasted power. What it really needs is a lower lockup point, say 50-60 km/h.

My fuel figures are all with E10 (including the Clevo).



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I found with my ef's and el if driving around town and not exceeding 60kph they all got better economy dropping them into 3rd instead of drive as they were always shifting in and out of 4th

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The EF's have a 70km/h lockup in 4th econ, and 60km/h in 4th power.
Not sure on early EL 6cyl.
The late EL hybrids (early 98 onwards) 6cyl and AU's, have a 60km/h lockup in econ.
 
The EL V8's of any year, have a 60km/h lockup also in econ.


I can't remember what my EF did before the T5 conversion but the EL wags I'm in now pops into O/D at about 85. Anything below that, you're on the converter (confirmed by making the tach needle move with throttle) once locked up, she's solid with road speed. Mine's not a hybrid.

I found with my ef's and el if driving around town and not exceeding 60kph they all got better economy dropping them into 3rd instead of drive as they were always shifting in and out of 4th


Thom I assume that ELs got a different tune due to going back to a dizzy (ie: maybe they're richer under load to stop detonation)? Without a wideband I'm just going off the instant L/100 on the trip meter and it's always in the 50s easing on it out of roundabouts, etc. As high as 99s when you tromp it. Sounds a bit drinky to me.

...it's just that I remember my old EF being a good 2-3L/100km better off on average.

I know the TPS is goofy (splutters sometimes at idle, a bit doughey on light throttle then suddenly takes off) so that's next on the list along with the shitty water pump.

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Quick question, the manifold I have was match ported to a different set of heads, it wasnt done to the new set, can that be restricting air flow and cause it to rise in temp?


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No.  Unless you've blocked off one cylinder completly. I usually port match to a stcok manifold gasket, they're pretty close to other gaskets, and once you've trimmed the egde of the ports, the heads will basically fit anything, from then on.

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Hey all, does anyone know if the serpentine pulley system are the same diameter as the standard pulleys? I know the Gilmer pulleys are a lot smaller,


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Hey all, does anyone know if the serpentine pulley system are the same diameter as the standard pulleys? I know the Gilmer pulleys are a lot smaller,


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I shouldn't imagine much difference, I know the E-series serpentine belts had a similar size crank pulley so the rest are about the same as v-belt too. I noticed in different Ford power steer pumps I had, serpentine and v-belt were the same diameter.

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On 4/22/2019 at 8:48 AM, Travis said:

Hey all, does anyone know if the serpentine pulley system are the same diameter as the standard pulleys? I know the Gilmer pulleys are a lot smaller,


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I have heard of guys having problems with the water pump spinning to fast, by increasing the coolant flow it does not allow enough time for It to cool when passing through the radiator.

 

i think the fix was a bigger water pump pulley maybe a chev one from memory?  Or this could just be a old school thing to do that never actually fixed the problem, I'm only going off what others have done 

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I have heard of guys having problems with the water pump spinning to fast, by increasing the coolant flow it does not allow enough time for It to cool when passing through the radiator.
 
i think the fix was a bigger water pump pulley maybe a chev one from memory?  Or this could just be a old school thing to do that never actually fixed the problem, I'm only going off what others have done 

Yes I have heard the same thing, I have been looking for a bigger pulley to suit the Gilmer belt, but no luck, I’m going to put the standard pulleys back on and test it out,


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Many older water pumps, particularly clevos, are very inefficient at higher rpm, causing a cavitation bubble to form in the centre of the impeller. This is partially cured by slowing it down with a bigger pulley and/or installing a restriction in the top hose so that the pump has a load to work against.

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Many older water pumps, particularly clevos, are very inefficient at higher rpm, causing a cavitation bubble to form in the centre of the impeller. This is partially cured by slowing it down with a bigger pulley and/or installing a restriction in the top hose so that the pump has a load to work against.

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What would you use as a restriction in the top hose?


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14 minutes ago, Travis said:

 

 

On 4/24/2019 at 8:20 AM, gerg said:

Many older water pumps, particularly clevos, are very inefficient at higher rpm, causing a cavitation bubble to form in the centre of the impeller. This is partially cured by slowing it down with a bigger pulley and/or installing a restriction in the top hose so that the pump has a load to work against.

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There was Australian company that ran this test vic based I think. They bolted a Cleveland water pump to a clear peice of Perspex  glass on a cooling system jig of some sort.  you had full view of what was going on behind the water pump they spun it at low rpm and then the took it up to mid to high rpm's and that is where it was having major issues. So there is already a solution out there, if this is your problem! I just can not remember the company name. I would call someone like pavtek or dandy engines ect 

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