XF EFI Fuel problem?

[SPACK 68]

Thanks PANKO....Trouble is at least finding another dissy to try...but its worth a shot..

[SPACK 68]

MR POISON...thought the AUTO one would be different as it changes "GEARS" AUTOMATICALLY compared to the manual one..IE receiving signals...

 

[Panko 2,480]

1 minute ago, SPACK said:

MR POISON...thought the AUTO one would be different as it changes "GEARS" AUTOMATICALLY compared to the manual one..IE receiving signals...

 

nope. the auto trans in these are "dumb" in the sense they have zero input from the ECU 

[Mr Polson 10,214]

MR POISON...thought the AUTO one would be different as it changes "GEARS" AUTOMATICALLY compared to the manual one..IE receiving signals...
 

Later model cars they are different as the autos became electronic, but in a XF they were still completely hydraulic operated. The gearbox knows how much throttle is open by the kickdown cable, and the engine doesn't care what gear the box is in.

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk

[SPACK 68]

Talked to the Mechanic again, and he says, It STARTS, IDLES, but it is running too RICH....If for IE its supposed to be giving 100 MLS OF PETROL on start up its giving 200 mls. The car drives but as soon as you ACCELERATE, it is RELEASING too much FUEL...AFM has been changed, EEC-1V has been changed, ECT checked, SPARK PLUGS, LEADS, COIL, have been changed..HE reckons if the DISSY was at fault IT would not START, IDLE, RUN...TFI is A-OK...Really at a lost..Unless the COMPUTER/S are not doing their job...AND HOW DOES ONE CHECK THAT..?

[deankxf 20,284]

sure its not something simple? like a temperature sender/switch telling the engine it's cold therefore dumps more fuel in? 

i hadn't read the whole lot, but fuel pressure or injector issues would be the first thing i'd thought if not the AFM

[deankxf 20,284]

when you say mechanic checked temp sender, there are 2, one is for the guage in the dash, and one is a switch .i assume much bigger, no idea what they do when unplugged, but it's been mentioned by crazy in earlier posts.

i would say your issue will have been covered in this post, double check that nothing's been overlooked or checked wrongly

[SPArKy_Dave 8,869]

The bosch temp senders are about $20...
I'd replace it and see. There's hardly any electronics in those engine bays.

 

[SPACK 68]

DEAN..He said he checked the voltage, hot and cold, and it was ok...SOMEHOW, to me, it seems the " ENGINE"...IS RECEIVING te message its too cold and getting a LOT of petrol all of the time...

[Outback Jack 6,352]

Need an obd 1 code reader... or see what codes the computer is throwing up, it will tell you of you ask the right way....
Someone here close enough with one to hook one up?
If not they are $300.
Im thinking temp sender or mass air flow meter is faulty... one controls fuel based on water temp ... other on air flow..... maybe even the oxygen sensor in the exhaust manifold... Its sensor based
Be most likely culprits.

Will have a gander in me workshop manual for xf. Which... by the way is a Nissan XFN ute workshop manual.
Ford XF workshop manuals you cant buy new.

Jack.

Sent from my GT-S7583T using Tapatalk

[SPACK 68]

The AFM and the EEC-1V HAVE been changed, twice....the coil, and the dissy, checked....AAAAAAGGGHH~~~

[Panko 2,480]

7 minutes ago, Outback Jack said:

Need an obd 1 code reader... or see what codes the computer is throwing up, it will tell you of you ask the right way....
Someone here close enough with one to hook one up?
If not they are $300.
Im thinking temp sender or mass air flow meter is faulty... one controls fuel based on water temp ... other on air flow..... maybe even the oxygen sensor in the exhaust manifold... Its sensor based
Be most likely culprits.

Will have a gander in me workshop manual for xf. Which... by the way is a Nissan XFN ute workshop manual.
Ford XF workshop manuals you cant buy new.

Jack.

Sent from my GT-S7583T using Tapatalk
 

Jack. these dont have oxy sensors. 

Temp sensor is something I also replaced when i was chasing my fault, and although it did not fix the issue, it DID have a smoother transition from cold start to normal idle, rather than going from one to the other like someone flicked a switch. so yes temp sensor could be the issue. 

however, i do not believe what your mechanic is saying. like i said in my previous post in here, i had a similar issue which after spending lots of money, and time replacing parts and sensors, ended up being the distributor. it would start, idle, but didnt like being under load. 

there is 1 other thing i dont think has been mentioned in here. 
the cold start solenoid/bypass valve which is bolted to the back of the rocker cover. unplug it when its both on cold start, and try driving it, then again when its at normal running temp, and see if it helps. again I had to replace mine because it would cause issues. 

[Panko 2,480]

the AFM/vane meter, there is a 6mm (i think) allen key bolt, which you turn to tune it. if you go too far one way, it will over fuel and cause the very issue you are having. turn it the other way it will run lean. between that, and you idle speed screw on the front of the throttle body, you should be able to fix the issue IF there is nothing else wrong with the system. 

[SPACK 68]

Thanks guys, have written this down, and will pass on 2 morrow...

[Outback Jack 6,352]

Cool. Be careful with the afm they can be damaged easy.
Gotta be along those lines.
Sorry I got the oxy sensor wrong but I mostly do 4L ohc stuff.
Panko.... hahahahahahahahaha.
Sorry Im not perfect.

Jack.

Sent from my GT-S7583T using Tapatalk

[Crazy2287 1,886]

Okay so i had to go wayyyyyyyy back to 2006 to get this data. This if from when i mapped my stock sensor for calibration within my MS1 ECU. so this "Should" be the data for the stock x-fal temp sender.
Bucket of ice water, Room temp, and boiling water. Resistance in Ohm. 

Input Data    
; Temp, degC     Resistance
;           0.5           86650
;            19           26000
;          99.8            2130

You're welcome.

It's important to note that you can't simply test the sensors, you must also test if the ECU is supplying the sensors with the correct voltages. Also check the sensors all have good earths. For example, a bad engine earth will take out multiple engine sensors. and a bad ECU earth will potentially take out all of them.

 

[SPACK 68]

I personally feel its the computer that is not working properly. Apparently a company that was at NEWMARKET, BRISBANE, is now at BRENDALE. I have one of the computers off of an XF GHIA. I will take it to them after a phone call and see if they can diagnose it and tell me if it is working correctly. CRAZY2287, My Mechanic has an FORD workshop manual so he has that data you put up there, THANKS, he was explaining it to me, so I Understood what that was about. What he cant also explain, is why DOES THE CAR WORK WITHOUT THE AFM,  IT works ...idles  and there is always, BLACK SOOT coming out the exhaust!!!!

[Outback Jack 6,352]

Mate... just go to a wreckers get a second hand ecu and plug her in.
Just make sure its the right one.
The workshop manual should give you the numbers for the specific one for your car. Make sure its correct to that and not the obe in car.
Its a cheap way to diagnose that problem. Cost ya $50.

I know its not a 4.1 but on my 4.0 when the aircon wouldn't work was actually blown high/low idle on ecu.
Secondhand ecu..... done.

My xfn book only covers carb models. Pre fuel inj model book.



Sent from my GT-S7583T using Tapatalk

[SPACK 68]

I have 4 COMPUTERS, Apparently it does not matter if they are auto or from a manual, so long as its not the EST model ones...With each of them plugged in, the car reacts the same...So I am thinking some INFO from some other out let is not right..OR may be the fuel REGULATOR is shot..!!

[SPACK 68]

At this time, I wish to thank each and every one for their INPUT to my problem, that is I am experiencing with this engine at the moment. THANK YOU ALL.

[Outback Jack 6,352]

Is fuel reg standard or adjustable?

Only overpressure in the fuel rail would do this if fuel return to tank was somehow blocked/ faulty.

It is a strange problem mate, not a common one.

Just gotta hang in there.

When I first got the outback I almost burnt it out of frustration.

I would take ecu out of equation then if you tried 4 at least one must be good.

 

These cars can test the patience of the best of them.

Quitters have sold cars because of it. Were here because we dont quit.

 

Logically one step at a time. ... you will find it.

Have a cuppa , chill for a bit... have a look at it with a fresh perspective after...

 

Oh.... and just cause an afm works at idle....or motor works without it at idle tells you its faulty or wiring to it is.... end of story.

Cause plugged in or out it doesnt matter and an air flow meter works on the amount of airflow to work out fuel.

As your airflow increases your ratio is wrong.... because the input is wrong.

 

And dont get shirty with us when a qualified mechanic cant even sort it for you youngun.... code reader would of saved him days .... you need to appreciate it could be a few things on these and not so easy without right info.

 

Jack.

 

Sent from my GT-S7583T using Tapatalk

 

 

 

 

[SPACK 68]

OUT BACK JACK, I am not getting shirty with any one here, Dont know where you got that Idea from,  as a matter of FACT, I am learning from each and every one here that has an input to my problem....The only thing, REALLY that has changed, are the INLET AND EXTRACTORS which I had CERAMICLY COATED, to try and cut the heat down, 1, burning out my solenoid on the starter, and heat going to my AFM..

[deankxf 20,284]

good luck, please let us know what it was if you find out. 

 

 back and find out about the rest of the issues to fix up as you get around to it.. like the door handles, break because the door hinges need reco/ bushing etc. 

 

[Mr Polson 10,214]

The computers are the same between Auto/Manual but different between leaded/unleaded, are you 100% they've been the right computers?

It is normal for them to idle without the AFM connected - or least mine does, from memory. Not as smooth as with it plugged in.

I'd be checking earth's and wiring. Has the dash been out before? The ECU wiring runs behind the dash, maybe it's been damaged somewhere out of sight?

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk

[Crazy2287 1,886]

It is unlikely that it will be the fuel pressure regulator. It's government over your fuel ratio is about 3% error. Unless the fuel pressure regulator is blocked then you will have no fuel returning to the tank. 

You can check this by either teeing in a pressure sender somewhere between the fuel rail and the pump and checking for 40-42 with eng running or 44psi with no manifold vac (eng not running or manifold ref line disconnected.) 

Or, a less perferred method, disconnect the return line and put it into a 2 litre bottle. measure how long it takes for the bottle to fill up when the fuel pump is running. 

The second option will also be reliant on the battery voltage, fuel pump and your fuel filter been in good condition, if they are not, it will give you a false reading.

 

Edit: also, if your exhaust temp is stuffing your starter motor, make sure you have enough timing. It's not uncommon for me to wind 16deg (+6 from stock) advance on the dizzy on a stock crossy.