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Outback Jack

4.0L OHC Lash Adjuster Shim replacement.

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Ok, going to change the standard 11mm lifters to 11mm Camtech ones.

These have a ball bearing instead of the washer type system... basically an anti-pump lifter.

Will get to pressure and 'bleed off' any excess instead of keep trying to pump up like a normal lifter.

 

The problem is there is a shim on every lifter.

These come in 1.6mm , 1.9mm , 2.4mm .

In order... plain, one dot, two dot.

 

First of all.... can't find a set of them and need 12 of each size to make sure got right sizes.

Second..... need the tool as pictured to compress the lifter in the arm so can do shimming properly.

20170611_172714_zpslo8cbqhb.jpg

 

This is the way the adjustment is done per Ford Bible.....

20170611_172703_zpspuerhzx1.jpg

 

Now from what I have seen... no one is doing this shim proceedure when recamming or replacing lifters and I want to know why?

 

Also do the camtech lifters even require shims?

 

I know how to do it... not a prob but this info maybe handy for someone later.

 

I did find a place on net , precision shims but I have no idea what kit they could make for me yet. Will find out.

 

Want to cam it up, new springs, t.i. chip etc but access to have head shaved is a problem. Fuel I can sort.

 

Motor has never overheated but not sure throwing an au head gasket and arp bolts at it will be enough alone.

Because I kinda hate to do lifters and be sooo close to a naked, easily removed cam.....

 

Jack.

 

 

Sent from my GT-S7583T

 

 

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You're right, I don't think many (if any) people do the shimming thing.
Most would just re-use the existing shims as fitted to the rocker arm from factory.

If the cam is not a re-ground on, done on a smaller base circle, the shims shouldn't need to be altered.
Most people bleed down those HLA lifters using a soft jaw vice, while they're out of the arm.

But truth be told, HLA's shouldn't need bleeding down if they're new, and/or if you've taken out the originals, then stripped them down and cleaned them.
with no oil in them, they have only the tension of their internal spring, to resist compressing them.

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I helped a good mate about 8 years ago fit a shaved and ported Tickford head, extractors, wade cam, adjustable cam gear.

We did as Dave said, compressed the original lifters in the vice with soft jaws. We also had it apart and cleaned while fitting the head which helped them bleed out. We got the shims from our local engine machine shop, he is an old Armenian fella, an absolute genius so I wouldn't be surprised if it's unusual for a machine shop to have them.

Make sure you get an adjustable cam gear, we ended up retarding the cam timing 2 degrees.

He later upgraded the ignition coil to an ice ignition mounted on the air box away from heat soak, the difference is amazing. He also fitted an el intake manifold, this helped a lot with the typical ohc of being a bit doughy off the line with an auto.

 

Why not look at a crow cam? They are a new cam so the base circle is the same as standard so no shims are needed.

 

Edit: I cannot remember what clearance you are meant to have initially between a collapsed lifter and valve stem. I'll ask him today, hopefully he remembers!

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I helped a good mate about 8 years ago fit a shaved and ported Tickford head, extractors, wade cam, adjustable cam gear.
We did as Dave said, compressed the original lifters in the vice with soft jaws. We also had it apart and cleaned while fitting the head which helped them bleed out. We got the shims from our local engine machine shop, he is an old Armenian fella, an absolute genius so I wouldn't be surprised if it's unusual for a machine shop to have them.
Make sure you get an adjustable cam gear, we ended up retarding the cam timing 2 degrees.
He later upgraded the ignition coil to an ice ignition mounted on the air box away from heat soak, the difference is amazing. He also fitted an el intake manifold, this helped a lot with the typical ohc of being a bit doughy off the line with an auto.
 
Why not look at a crow cam? They are a new cam so the base circle is the same as standard so no shims are needed.
 
Edit: I cannot remember what clearance you are meant to have initially between a collapsed lifter and valve stem. I'll ask him today, hopefully he remembers!

Hey mate, yeah the actual job of putting lifters in not the problem.
Valve clearance-adjuster collapsed is 0.4-1.1. mm? Not sure if thats mm or not.
I dont need to collapse lifters apart to check shims from cam
clearance to rocker arm height.
And with no oil in em... can crush em with ya fingers.
I dont oil em up... go in dry... like a school kid.... lol

Oh... and I have the valve timing figures and specs for 4.0 vs 4.0 xr6
Change ya valve springs, guides, cam and shave the head ..... whallahh!! Xr6 head.... is the ONLY difference...
Besides the fancy cover.
Chamber size 4.0L.... 62.25-64.75
4.0L XR6 .......58-60.
Thats a shaved head cause internal parts are identical besides those listed above.
Gain 12kw and 17NM of torque.

You're right, I don't think many (if any) people do the shimming thing.
Most would just re-use the existing shims as fitted to the rocker arm from factory.
If the cam is not a re-ground on, done on a smaller base circle, the shims shouldn't need to be altered.
Most people bleed down those HLA lifters using a soft jaw vice, while they're out of the arm.
But truth be told, HLA's shouldn't need bleeding down if they're new, and/or if you've taken out the originals, then stripped them down and cleaned them.
with no oil in them, they have only the tension of their internal spring, to resist compressing them.

Cheers Dave, wealth of knowledge as always.
I got a spare rocker assembly in back of spares ute.... will grab all the shims.... if there and clean em up and hope between them and what I have its enough.... I will find somewhere to have some kits made up and get some extras done up.
Because in all honestly it would be like driving around in a crossy with the wrong tappet to pushrod clearance... just not adjustable..... lol.

I'll use a set of stilsons with hose on the jaws to hold em closed in the rocker arms if need be while I measure clearance... Im a bass player... should be doable by hand... hehe....

Jack crush lifter.... lol.


Sent from my GT-S7583T

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Ok.... went a diggin in back of parts Outback... thought I had a rocker assembly and cracked head in there somewhere.... haha..

This is the top of a 4.0L shim and this side goes into the rocker arm.....
20170612_121717_zpskzs1h6ds.jpg

This side has 3 oil grooves and the lifter head sits on it (open end). Always faces away from rocker arm!!!!!!
20170612_121727_zpssgysq6w1.jpg

Managed to salvage 10 shims from old assembly...
20170612_122724_zpsousqdaov.jpg

Still have all 12 lifters... but had to search for them...lol
20170612_122735_zpsiuhoqgrs.jpg

This is the order of install....
20170612_122854_zpss8iezvvp.jpg

Rest of rocker assembly has been sprayed in wd40 and wrapped in gladwrap and cardboard so have a spare.

Whats interesting is every shim should have an identifying mark according to manual. One , two or three dots.... no farkin dots there unless I'm blind.
In fact I would say they where Identical sizes by eye..... havent got a micrometer.....

The mystery deepens....

Jack.

Sent from my GT-S7583T

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Jack that measurement 0.4 - 1.1 would be mm. Between a collapsed lifter and the valve stem tip. The only reason you need to collapse the lifter would be to measure the clearances ( and of course making sure they are clean). I'd be putting they in a container of oil before assembly then popping them straight into the rocker arm, not dry. But that's just me .

Wade cams ( now owned by Clive cams) had a base circle 50 thou smaller ( 1.27mm ) than factory. Or use a crow cam, which is a new billet so the base circle is the same as factory so no need to stuff around with shims.

No matter what cam you fit though, it should be dialled in to suit your needs and get the most out of it. Your wasting money if you don't.

Good luck with it Jack.

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Cheers VB.
Yeah lifter shims still needed with crow cam its the rocker gear shimming your thinking of.
Any other cam needs rocker gear shimmed.
Always on any cam need the correct clearance at the lifter so shims are a must.

Lifter tick dissapeared today..... twice.
Then came back when put ute away....
Big Reds a tease.

Jack.

Sent from my GT-S7583T

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Cheers VB.
Yeah lifter shims still needed with crow cam its the rocker gear shimming your thinking of.
Any other cam needs rocker gear shimmed.
Always on any cam need the correct clearance at the lifter so shims are a must.

Lifter tick dissapeared today..... twice.
Then came back when put ute away....
Big Reds a tease.

Jack.

Sent from my GT-S7583T



Maybe I could have written it a bit clearer, the crow cams don't require any extra shims but still requires the shims that were fitted at the factory. By shimming the lifter it also adjusts the roller in the rocker to cam lobe contact.
Taken from t.i. Performance

6416643441a06540c5fcd5d15b9c3ee6.png

Good luck with it jack.

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Cool VB.... for some reason I thought they meant shimming the rocker assembly. Lol.
Your probably spot on, I havent slept much for a long time... everday.... just a lil frazzled......so excuse my dumbness.

Have to get cam chain tensioner tool, lash adjuster bleed down tool(in rocker arm screw down type) and kit for tensioner incase o rings perish on removal.
That should do it.... I hope... lol.

Jack.

Sent from my GT-S7583T

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All good mate.

I feel for you, I don't think I've had a good night sleep in years thanks to the kids. But they are worth it. Very different to your sleep deprivation.

I have forgotten so much about the ohc tensioner set up( last one I did I just unscrewed the whole thing so I didn't have to adjust it) could you put up photos from the workshop manual on how to set it up?

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