Jump to content
Server maintenance Read more... ×

Leaderboard


Popular Content

Showing content with the highest reputation on 08/08/2018 in all areas

  1. 2 points
    gerg

    CLEVELAND ENGINE TALK

    Fun fact: Ford Oz had a secret stash of clevos put aside for DeTomaso that didn't dry up until 1988. Euro emissions laws were still pretty happy up until the 90s. From then, Panteras and Longchamps used the Mustang donk. Sent from my CPH1607 using Tapatalk
  2. 2 points
    gerg

    CLEVELAND ENGINE TALK

    That's pretty sad, although they've been out of production there for 44 years now, so not that surprising. About a million were made, which sounds like a lot but to compare, the small block Chev reached 70 million. Back in the 90s, they used to have a cash for clunkers scheme where they'd pay you to scrap your car. Lots of classics got squished. In USA, the 351M/400 is much more common as it was made for over a decade. Sent from my CPH1607 using Tapatalk
  3. 2 points
    bear351c

    CLEVELAND ENGINE TALK

    De Tomaso Pantera......... They love them.! So, do 71 - 73 Mussie owners. A sweet roar and an attractive looking donk, I must say. But, i'm biased.
  4. 2 points
    gerg

    CLEVELAND ENGINE TALK

    Yes please! Sent from my CPH1607 using Tapatalk
  5. 2 points
    gerg

    CLEVELAND ENGINE TALK

    I'e heard that any D2 blocks were still US cast. The machinery that got shipped out here was useless for our local production as our iron was harder to machine using their gear. They had to re-engineer everything including the casting process. I think the easiest way to tell if it's a Cleveland or Geelong casting is to look in the valley for a "CF" (a big "C" wrapped around a little "f") or a simple "GF", for their respective foundries. As the Aussie engine plant was small-volume, they never updated their master moulds, so as they wore out, the casings became more and more wonky. Core-shift was becoming a problem by the time XD-XE blocks were popping out. The pillow block was a partial fix but the V8 was out of vogue by then. EDIT: I'll clarify that "D2AE-CA" originally referred to US-sourced blocks that could (not always) end up as Cobra Jet engines. Aussie blocks still used this exact part number but were not performance engines. The Aussie moulds must have been based on the CJ ones, including carrying over the part number. People often thought they'd scored a 4-bolt block going by the number but the only way to know is to pop the sump. All clevo castings were the same at the time: Boss, CJ or grandad's 2V Fairlane. The 4-bolt mains were just an extra machining operation. Ford in their wisdom, created a system and then proceeded to not stick to it. Sent from my CPH1607 using Tapatalk
  6. 2 points
    gerg

    CLEVELAND ENGINE TALK

    Yes smog killed it, that and the fuel crisis. Why build a thirstier, more expensive engine to have the same performance as its smaller, lighter, cheaper cousin? It did live on in a different form in the 400/351M as a luxury car/truck engine, but that version was never made to be a performance unit, and mostly existed in the smog era when pretty much all engines were dogs. I've always viewed the Cleveland as a race engine de-tuned for the street. It was conceived at a time in the mid-60s when small cars and fuel economy were a laughable idea in the US. Performance was king, and Ford was smashing it on all fronts. But lead-up time for a new design was much longer back then. By the time the Cleveland was finally introduced, the need for bigger, faster, thirstier was starting to fade. They introduced a lot of innovations that were very outside the box for Ford at the time. They borrowed ideas external to the Ford design school with the splayed valves (1950s Chrysler poly & early 60s big block Chev), poly chamber (Chrysler), fuel pump mounting design (Oldsmobile) cast-in timing case (also Olds) , high-ratio self aligning rocker design (BB Chev), all thrown into a package that could be produced on similar production lines to the existing "Windsor" design. There's good reason for this shift in thinking. Ford apparently wanted the best engineers to head their performance-oriented approach to design, and poached a number of GM engineering gurus to start the process. This is why many ideas from their rivals were implemented with the Cleveland. Another aspect of its design was its ability to be marinised easily. The one-piece front timing cover eliminated a lot of leak points that the Windsor would have had. Some suggest that this engine was designed with a marine capability as its main priority. The original name "335 series" was apparently coined to denote the intended stroke in inches. This same numbering system was also initially used on the new big block of similar design, the"385" until it was eventually referred to as the "Lima". Despite the 3.35" stroke never being used in production, it's what stuck until they were more often referred to as "Cleveland" and "Windsor", to differentiate the two 351 designs by the respective engine plants at which they were made. I might also touch on the head design, the more significant being the 4V variant. It was very radical for the time, and was a totally different approach to making an engine breathe. Instead of a long, steady ingestion of air (through longer camshaft duration, lift, etc) the premise of the 4V was instead for short, rapid gulps through big ports and valves (ie large nostrils). This enabled some respectable power with a relatively sedate cam profile and valvetrain. Up to a point, this worked, but then design limitations on the exhaust side hampered any further improvements. This coupled with race engine builders not knowing how to approach the large port design, they started filling them back in and making up exhaust port plates, etc. and just building the engine as they would any other type (Chev, Windsor, Mopar) and any design advantage of the port section was lost. As a factory performance engine, they were brilliant. Its lifespan was cut short, so much of the work that could've been continued never happened. Ford Aus inherited the design but didn't do much more to it other than squeeze what they could out of the 2V design. Because our emission laws (and fuel prices) soon followed the rest of the world, it would suffer the same fate. Have you ever heard someone mention "Cleveland" and "fuel economy" in the same sentence? Only if that sentence also included the word "bad". Sent from my CPH1607 using Tapatalk
  7. 1 point
    bear351c

    CLEVELAND ENGINE TALK

    You can buy lifter bore sleeve kits, now. Ream out, press in sleeve, ream again, problem solved. Simples.
  8. 1 point
    bear351c

    CLEVELAND ENGINE TALK

    The Yanks didn't really get to enjoy the Clevo, as they only had it for a couple of years, before they went back to the smaller, revvy Windsor style blocks. Us Aussies had them from XW to XE, and a couple of Effies/Ambo's and stuff. But, a lot of US Clevo's made it to Nascar, Oval track and some drag cars, with great success. Obviously, they had to get around the oiling issue, but, once you got over 5 grand those 4V heads would come into their own. Much has been written/spoken/debated about this engine family, but, they're reasonably priced and make good HP when built with the issues mentioned. They are heavy, and wide, and certainly not for every vehicle. Tim Meyer, Arrow etc.... have made new Clevo's... with the oil starvation issue resolved. Why would they spend thousands on R&D, casting, machining, if there wasn't a market for them.? Would love to be able to afford a "brand new" Clevo. All alloy with ally heads and intake, all cast to look original. ....and a 6/71.
  9. 1 point
    Valvebouncer

    CLEVELAND ENGINE TALK

    Wouldn’t it be 1971? Remember we were the only country to have a 302 clevo and they came out in the XA in 1972.
  10. 1 point
    CHESTNUTXE

    CLEVELAND ENGINE TALK

    Very good question i think its around late xb or xc era the first bunch of NASCAR style blocks were cast as well but didnt have the pillows and are very rare.2nd NASCAR blocks were done around 81 or 82
  11. 1 point
    SPArKy_Dave

    CLEVELAND ENGINE TALK

    What year, did the Geelong Foundry start casting Clevo blocks?
  12. 1 point
    gerg

    CLEVELAND ENGINE TALK

    D2 = 1972 A = model line E = engine CA = Cleveland or Boss (not specific apparently) Sent from my CPH1607 using Tapatalk
  13. 1 point
    deankxf

    what ratio in turbo 250xflow

    also don't rule out the 2.92 depending on the combo also.. i've seen some turbo 250s running the 2.92 and they pull like a train with a smaller turbo making boost early
  14. 1 point
    gerg

    CLEVELAND ENGINE TALK

    Interesting that they still used the D2AE part number even though it was made in a completely different country, manufacturing process and material. Sent from my CPH1607 using Tapatalk
  15. 1 point
    Valvebouncer

    CLEVELAND ENGINE TALK

    https://www.tmeyerinc.com/product/track-boss-cleveland-block/
  16. 1 point
    CHESTNUTXE

    CLEVELAND ENGINE TALK

    the yanks found a backwater planet called geelong and got rid of it all ,here is a picture of my std bore pillow block may 82 cast.
  17. 1 point
    Valvebouncer

    CLEVELAND ENGINE TALK

    They can have very thin bore walls, I have seen some bored 30 thou over and hitting a water jacket unless it is one of the bulge blocks with 4 bolts mains. They can also run hot easily if the cooling system isn’t bang on. None of this explains why they didn’t use them for long though. I think that is more to do with physical size. The heads are massive compared to Windsor heads which externally cut back in on the exhaust side which means the engine isn’t as wide and fits between shock towers easily .
This leaderboard is set to Melbourne/GMT+11:00
×